1111	Forums / Main Forum / Re: Whose prisoner are you?	on: June 16, 2012, 01:24:29 PM
You got to understand that there are people who forgive others who have harmed you and they will not stand on your side even if you are still being harmed. So there are people who spread the curses of evil men by being lazy and unresponsive. And there are people who have a superficial view of the means who use these means as the primary thing they trust in. And religion to them is like a job where they just clock in and do their service. This is what universalism produces and supports. But in taking a clear look at all of scripture God is both condemning and supportive at the same time. To say that God is all forgiving is to make a god of your own making. Some of the most subversive people are ones who are universalist. Because they only live by a general view of every man. And to say that God offers forgiveness thus you have no rite to defend yourself is to be hateful to Gods value of you as He created you. And its to deny the fundamental motive of God in creating evil as God being mean since there is no reason for a universal God to defend through disaster. So that since the world is a place of sorrow and pain then God is blamed out of hopelessness and weakness to support because if He is all forgiving then He certainly is not involved in protecting those people from abuse. This laissez- faire  God doesnt respond to abuse with defense but rather is a God who curbs pride at the expense of providing real support. lol But we must always vindicate God because He is defending.
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1112  Forums / Theology Forum / Re: The coming of the great Apocalypse on: June 16, 2012, 12:28:13 PM Revelation is describing a political system that is religious. And the references to economies is the difference between the free flow of monies and fascism. The quart of wheat for a days wage is the reference to the amount of labor it takes in earning. And we see that greed is what drives God to respond to these evil governments. But there is a further description in the locust and horses. Because we see that when the world becomes evil and greed reigns then there is a new experience of bondage. Which is threats on the one hand and murders on the other. And if you look at the context there are worshiping of demons, idols that bring economic profit. Then you have murders, magic arts, which are from demonic worship...cursing the poor ... and sexual immorality and theft.. which is the false scales  paid out to labor and how prices are made. Now this is exactly how God rules from the heavens .He knows how evil men stand hidden behind the troubles of this world. Behind the sorrows from the world is a man who devised that scheme to trap his neighbor. This hidden man uses his money to gain respect and yet to bribe evil governments for more power. And you see that this angel of the abyss actually stands as the cause of all of this trouble. His forces rise to power like smoke and they come with threats and destruction over mankind. This constant threatening and the economy of greed makes men long to die. Look at these chineses workers jumping from their places of work rather than enduring this system of abuse and profit. So God will respond with seven times more punishment for these powerful abusers. Now this reference to the hebrew name of this abyss angel and the reference to the four angels sandwiched in between the locust an the horse point to this activity going on in response to the events of this world since the beginning of time. Or its present where the Hebrews are present and it may be that the angel was released at that time along with the four angels or they get released for a time and then brought back into their prison again. Until they are finally thrown into the lake of fire with the Devil. If we are gonna say that the palm branches are pointing to incarnation time then we must keep to this kind of interpretation. Remove Reply Quote Notify

1113  Forums / Main Forum / Re: Whose prisoner are you? on: June 16, 2012, 11:48:49 AM The Psalmist was always aware of the potential in the as a king to be entrapped in someones scheme. And that was why he had wisdom. Because it was his description of a prison. And if you remember that God had determined that his own son would work to undermine his happiness and trust in God through treason ..the Psalmist experienced this for years. You see this in his cries to be released. Because any time a believer experiences scorn or shame its because of opposition. I do not think any one who was like minded as Johnathan would be out to undermine his purposes. But we see that society can be so evil that it forces itself into your private world. This is what is so deceptive about who God is and what He is saying. Because a lot of people are looking at these things and chasing phantoms. This is why there is only one way. There is only one view. There is only one standard in which we compare everything else against that standard. Because that one standard is called the rock. Its a rock that is promised to us if we think correctly and pray accordingly. THis is why religion is so dangerous because its so easy to presume that what we know is actually how God is working. And if we fail to know what God has said then our presumptions will hurt a lot of people. The christian faith is not for the shallow or faint of heart. Its really learning strength that motivates us to overcome. But there are absolute promises that have power to turn the world upside down .Because our new life is not a small path but we have world powers or powers that are eternal. When we take these statements for granted we do it to our own harm.  Reply Quote Notify

1114  Forums / Main Forum / Re: Whose prisoner are you? on: June 16, 2012, 11:09:56 AM Let me talk about prison in the bible. For a christian there are really no interior prisons. Because prison is not understanding the difference between human hate and divine retribution. ...cursing and blessing... The only prison that christians find themselves in are traps and words of the wicked. You must understand that God has given us a clear understanding of ourselves. And we do not know who we are unless we understand what God has said we are. lol Now listen people swear by their beliefs. They swear by their beliefs because they live by their idols. There is no man who lives without a view of the perfect man. But its fundamental that the motives for viewing the perfect man make up two groups. Those who are in bondage or prison to sin that being complete darkness and those who have been given eyes to see and are free.lol Now listen to me the spiritual eyes to see include our ability to apply wisdom to our situations that the blind do not have. This is why our identity in Christ and understanding it is absolutely essential. We must always begin with what is said about us as the line we draw in the sand because we are what we our identity is. This is why nothing in side of our world of self power has evil overcoming good. Because we have the Spirit dwelling in us. So we are no longer the wicked relationally. Therefore we are not what we do in the next action but we are what is declared we are. God tells us what we are and what the world is and we declare it to be so. We are not trying to get street smarts by just observing and experiencing the world but we are thinking thoughts after God declaring the truth about the world and it is so.   Reply Quote Notify

1115  Forums / Main Forum / Re: Whose prisoner are you? on: June 16, 2012, 10:52:52 AM See now im old enough to compare what they are saying with the old ways. And this sort of stuff is not from the bible. This is a teaching that we have no ability to judge another person as being dangerous and destructive. My friends this is modern universalism. This is the most effective Unitarianism that has ever been developed in this world. Its science and Universalism mixed together. A lot of people now that i read on the news or in other realms of my life think that giving attention to wisdom in the bible is not a prerequisite to knowing wisdom. And in fact as i said that its really a mark of shame to use the ot as a tool to argue with people. I will gladly bear that shame for the sake of standing and not giving into a mixture of philosophy with religion because what i write as doctrine i will be responsible before God. I promise you that when i pray a Psalm that it goes out into eternity. It is a seal in the acts of God to do as He promises. lol There is no pragmatism. But this stuff is simply a form of brain washing by the elites. This is the new social order of the corporate control over america. lol Public relations through the new social moral instruction that abuses the rites of people to to change the personal value of private identity and thus an abuse of authority.  And its simply this .. its a system of belief that identifies people through a culture in which private matters are the new public matters in this connecting culture. And basically its like the mark of the beast. Once you expose yourself to the group you are plugged into the culture. And the sorrows that drove you are were only necessary because they formed you psychological bend. lol This is a process theology philosophy. Now listen your not incomplete or without personal help in private. Private lives are real lives. What happens in private creates your public life. You are not a product of a philosophy or an need to be social. The need to be social is fulfilled by God in private. Your healthy view of the world is only developed in private. The private world is an interior world of supernatural experiences. When you are successful in this world its because you overcome in your private world. It has nothing to do with adding something or trying to change something. Its a world of thinking developed in you in private. lol And so your private world is more important than your public world. You are what you are in private. And so you cannot experience salvation in a group. You can only experience salvation in your mind and heart. This is why you can eliminate all your potential for sin in a outward conformity with alot of social enforcement but when you get in private you experience imaginations of things and people that are nothing but idol worship. Because sorrow is not something that comes from our actions but its from inside of us from our indwelling sin. Our enjoyment of this life is knowing how our sin has given us the motive to find all of our happiness in God. Sin should not motivate us to have friends. lol   Reply Quote Notify

1116  Forums / Theology Forum / Re: Temptation, how to cope on: June 16, 2012, 09:50:49 AM Joker i understand the eye thing. Dont use your eyes to sin. But on the other hand i dont think that Jesus was using the baptist argument we dont dance, smoke of chew and we dont go with people who do. lol But there is a much more profound thing here. Because He is confronting the religious leaders with a public teaching. Jesus had warned them about cleaning the outside of the cup while at the same time they were filled with all kinds of threats and violence. They did not have a heart that was given to peace but they were for war. And if you look any private issue is to be resolved though overlooking sin in the spirit of forgiveness. But these religious leaders where guilty of charging their whole generation with guilt through acting as wolves and not shepherds. They were using the peoples money for their own self interest. And they in fact were involved in a scheme with the tax collectors. Its funny because the whole teaching on the beggar who needed a piece of bread was set over against the Pharisee who bragged about paying all of his debts. I think Jesus was showing how the religious leaders had developed this elaborate scheme to extort money from the poor. Obviously if any one knows anything about ot wisdom Jesus was always confronting something that was more hidden and destructive than just worrying about one sin in a poor person. But sins are generational and any decline in a generation is due to the practices of the powerful. I could discuss the adulterous and the pharisees because this is really eye opening and a kind of judgement pronounced before the great judgement. I am talking about that day and biblical language not making references to comparing in todays situtation .. thats a matter of individual counsel.    Reply Quote Notify

1117  Forums / Theology Forum / Re: Temptation, how to cope on: June 16, 2012, 08:47:57 AM Quote from: Joker on June 16, 2012, 07:38:01 AM Quote from: 1Sinner on June 14, 2012, 04:05:14 PM This is a serious question.  We all experience temptation, so we all  have to deal with it.  My question is what practical tactics do you use to deal with temptation? What do you do when tempted to not fall into sin?   Practical Biblical answer: If your right eye makes you stumble, tear it out and throw it from you; for it is better for you to lose one of the parts of your body, than for your whole body to be thrown into hell.  If your right hand makes you stumble, cut it off and throw it from you; for it is better for you to lose one of the parts of your body, than for your whole body to go into hell. Matthew 5:29-30 I'd have to cut off my head, 'cuz that's the part of the body that makes me sin the most. But if you don't think Jesus really wants you to amputate a few body parts... Look, you're not going to stop doing "thought, word, and deed against God's divine majesty" in this world.  You're not.  But you don't have to give in to every temptation either.  Practical advice?  Since prayer has already been mentioned, well, sometimes it helps to call a trusted Sister or Brother.  They may be able help get you out of the situation.  (Or, you may drag them down with you, but hey...)    I agree but i do not believe in relationships that are based upon surveillance and blackmail. I would be very careful in this culture. Because a lot of this stuff on sin is not about developing relationships but its avoiding sin. A relationship is a give and take kind of experience not a one sided affair. The old saying is if you dont respect yourself no one else is gonna respect you. The bible is clear that we should only develop relationships with those who are like minded. This is why the Psalmist had such a hard time in this world because for every one time in our lives we enjoy close relationships the most of the time we experience trusting in God alone. Its interesting because God gives us both in our lives. And this is the method He uses to help us grow. The Psalms describe our frustration with loneliness and misunderstanding as a necessary part in being weened from this world and finding all of our confidence in God. Our greatest need is not to find ourselves or find health through positive relationships but its to be happy in one thing alone. Because when we have found God we are free and happy. Its funny because when all of this relationship started in the 70s it was understood that it was built on a lack of conviction and would lead someone to a life of non commitment and avoiding God. People began to think they had lost themselves .lol.  And so people began abandoning their marriages to find themselves. lol. But the truth is that we cannot find ourselves unless we have found God and we cannot find God outside of Gods sovereign design for our lives. But the basic teaching is that only God can fill that vacuum in our lives. This is why the bible warns us about idols. Idols are anything that take our minds captive other than what is spoken as understood to be the fear of God. What does the bible say? The fear of God is the beginning of wisdom. I know its difficult to accept something very simple but the fear of God actually is learning to think Gods thoughts after Him. Basically you got to learn to experience that what they believe is screaming so loud that we cannot hear what they are saying. lol. You can look as pristine as a glowing white light and still be full of devils. This is why religion can be so weird.     Reply Quote Notify

1118  Forums / Theology Forum / Re: Temptation, how to cope on: June 14, 2012, 04:17:55 PM Prayer according to His word is our best resistance. Because we do not have enough power and ability to resist temptation in ourselves. Now think about this. Why is it that christians are always talking about the problem with sin in their lives? I mean if God actually saves a person.. like your given a million dollars .. that would in reality change your life. You would not be in the same position in society. But salvation is a greater reality and its more successful. So there is a mixture about us and what we believe because we still have the old voices talking to us. These voices are like little devils whispering in our ears. And these voices are real because even tho we have been given joy,peace , patience , kindness, love, etc we still get controlled by fear, guilt, anxiety, jealousy, sorrow, and unbelief. And the presence of these sinful inclinations help buttress our temptations. Because they are like the little voices that teach us that we are not what Christ has remade us to be.  You know what happens instead of us acknowledging that we are weak we make a deal with the devil. Its like a dare. We say that the next time we fall we will try harder. And so we focus on becoming more willing through anxious thoughts. But the whole purpose of our salvation is to rest in what we already have. So we need to know when we are being lied to , how we are being lied to and who is lying to us. lol i will continue this.   Reply Quote Notify

1119  Forums / Theology Forum / Re: Being called home early due to sin.... on: June 14, 2012, 04:01:11 PM Quote from: poppy on June 12, 2012, 09:26:23 PM Stumbling, willful, headstrong is my middle name. And I live twenty minutes from Corinth. Yikes. Poppy i know your probably a not willing but did you know that for a saint its not that we are head strong but we are now weak? Because we no longer come to God as a person who wishes God would make us more willing. We just acknowledge that we need God. Poppy its like this... If you planned a trip for you and your wife and you got all the eggs in order as a gift for her. And your whole purpose was to show her how valuable she was but through the whole trip she was apologizing for how she is a bad person, wouldnt you just want her to say words of appreciation and praise? This is the same thing God has done for us. He has made us new and pure. He has given us His only Son as a guarantee of His care and love for us. He not only gave us all He had but He changed our name by adopting us into His family. This Father of the whole universe who is eternal and unchanging calls us His own sons. So heres the thing. Its amazing that He does this with the fore thought that we would not keep our part of the transaction. But He looks at us as if we deserve the whole world. As if we owned everything. Yet He knows that we will not be confident enough to ask Him for things we dont deserve so He gives us His promises and His word so that we will ask not as a dumb fool but as someone who deserves His representation. And so He  not only saves us from all this foolishness but He actually gives us new clothes and puts a new song in our hearts. Our problem is that we are not strong enough for Him to gift us with what He is like. We are all weak. Reply Quote Notify

1120  Forums / Theology Forum / Re: The Covenant Avenging Sword: John Arrowsmith on: June 14, 2012, 03:48:37 PM You have God warning nations about the level of evil that godless men create. How do they create this? In their hearts they say there is no God. This is their desire to not think of God and thus they devise wicked schemes. These schemes turn into laws and principles that they demand everyone to live by. And so we have the ten commandments turned upside down. Instead of rewarding men for worshiping only one God they devise ways to accept any god. Because men worship other gods then they create laws that come from graven images that they imagine. Other religious systems that bind men to these principles. Instead of exalting God they create a system of belief that makes man equal with God or lowers God to the level of man by their doctrine. Society begins to speak completely different than when the ten commandments were taught as who God is. When men begin to own their own lips then wicked men freely strut about. They actually are proud of stealing, adultery, disrespect for Gods authority, and taking advantage of the helpless. God must respond or the world would become a total chaos. This is why God cannot abandon His elect. His word and promises are yea and amen.His word is said to be tested and purified 7 times. And Christ is said to have seven horns. Its perfect authority ... responding to the seven deadly sins of the wicked by the curses of the law. His eyes or His direct knowledge in the event. Which is wise by the prayer of the righteous. Christ will respond to the abusive threats and curses of the wicked. How does He act ? He hears the cries of the helpless and the righteous prayers that are formed by the word of God. The righteous prayers are ordered so that in praying according to Gods word then our prayers are purified seven times. These are prayers of judgement against the schemes of men who have become their own gods by their own laws in defiance of Gods law and destroying the helpless and poor. God must reduce men to be mere men... or God must banish wicked men from society. That is God must reduce the confidence of men so they know that God is God.  Remove Reply Quote Notify

1121  Forums / Theology Forum / Re: Dispensationalism on: June 14, 2012, 12:13:24 PM The day of the Lord, day of vengeance is very much a Jewish historical fact. It is basically the day that Israel ceased to be a nation and it includes this age. This is a clear break from the ot ceremonial laws in which Christ actually became that Lamb that was slain. As Hebrews says that those ot ceremonial laws were a shadow of the things to come. Obviously all these types in the ot are finally fulfilled in Christ. The problem with dispensational teaching is a textual one. Because if the kingdom is future on this earth then all of the culture of Israel must be reestablished. Because you cant separate the kingdom language from the ceremonial culture in the text. If you look in Revelation in the discussion of the 144 000 who are sealed these saints are carrying palm branches in their hands. The Jews just before Christ was to enter Jerusalem to be crucified in His entrance on a donkey was ushered in by Jews who were holding palm branches. So how can you claim that this time period is future? And you see the description of the evil governments who are controlled by the angel of the abyss. Who had a name in Hebrew. (Abbadon) This is clearly a reference to the Hebrew culture and the presence of the nations who opposed Israel through out their history and culminating in the fall of Jerusalem in 70ad which is the day of vengeance. And in fact the 4 angels who are released from the river Euphrates takes us all the way back to the beginning of time. This is clearly an ongoing battle between heaven and earth. The truth is clear that our major problem is that man is caught in between this spiritual fighting. I think its a stretch to put this in the future without any  reference of it in the near context. All of this language in Revelation is the ot language of God describing how He rules the nations in the Psalms. To say that Christ is going to reestablish the ot forms in ruling on the earth is to make of no effect His final work over sin and death. Even if we have Christ kingdom rule through all eternity and Christ earthly rule for 1000 yrs this creates a contradiction not a mystery. Because to say that the word "in Christ" is fulfilled all things is the same thing as to say that "in Christ" we have been given every thing that pertains to life and godliness. In a sense your creating a different Christ by making these different.         Reply Quote Notify

1122  Forums / Break Room / Re: Touch hunger on: June 14, 2012, 01:41:46 AM Quote from: Gouda on June 13, 2012, 11:46:24 PM I disagree that I'm building my faith on my own diary or that the Psalms develop Christ in us, the hope of glory, but I'll leave it alone because I don't want to insult you. Your opinions are much appreciated Gouda... i was just giving you what i experience. Reply Quote Notify

1123  Forums / Break Room / Re: Touch hunger on: June 13, 2012, 07:18:22 PM Quote from: Gouda on June 13, 2012, 07:08:59 PM I agree, and I guess I misunderstood your first post. I thought you were chastizing 1Sinner for asking here, and me and Joker for trying to offer some advice. Many of the psalms were written by David and described his experiences and what he learned from them.  I think our experiences become kind of psalms in our life, too, when we learn something new (wisdom).  For instance, that story about my friend was something that I learned several years ago--I learned how incredibly important human touch is for some people, though that's not so much the case for me (compassion).  Then I hear someone struggling with that, and my "psalm" comes to mind, so I "sing" it.  It may be useless to 1Sinner, but at least for me, I didn't downplay how important this is for her because I learned it matters a great deal to other people. And, I totally agree on the transcending power of artistic expression. Yes i know that David expressed himself but they are a universal application of experience for every christian. Because the first Psalm explains that the rest of the book is describing the perfect man.  David as a sinner offers to us the opportunity to kind of live our experience in identifying the emotions that are out of order in our perfect enjoyment. And so David has given us a book where we can realign ourselves through these complaints, praises, petitions, and struggles with sin. The Psalms develop Christ in us the hope of glory. David pours out his heart to God through the inspiration of the Holy Spirit.  So this is not a diary but its a better way than expression our experiences in a diary. This is our ability in a sense to sit in the eternal counsel chair and speak directly to Christ through the Holy Spirit. So that when we explain our problems, fears, our sorrows, anxieties , then Christ hears us and after we have poured out all of our troubles that are bottle up then its more healing that takes place than the best counselor. And Christ promises to do more than we could ever ask or think.   Reply Quote Notify

1124  Forums / Break Room / Re: Touch hunger on: June 13, 2012, 06:53:23 PM Quote from: Gouda on June 13, 2012, 06:43:43 PM MBG, I hear your frustration, but I have to say you're going to continue to be very frustrated if you expect people to stop asking others in their community for ideas and suggestions. It's pretty normal to learn from the experiences of others and to gain a different perspective.  It may or may not be helpful, but it's not binding on anyone anyway. And, I'm not reading those NT quotes the same as you are. It doesn't seem to say, as you mention, "..[teaching] wisdom is only learned by the Psalms"; it says "psalms, hymns, and songs from the Spirit".  Don't you think the Spirit can give a person a "song", a word of teaching for someone who asks them for input? I don't know--it's just a thought--I'll go study those further. I think the apostle put the Psalms first because the other two are based upon the wording of wisdom that is in the word. You see this in how the scripture has been written in the narrative. All of the redemptive words applied to the ot narrative are the Holy Spirits words that are explained in their worship book. I wouldnt limit this to just music and singing because the bible says that we are to speak to one another the words of wisdom. And as you know Gouda i am very much an encourager of experience. One of my most enjoyable writings is Misses Edwards account of the revivals. That women can absolutely lite a fire of the Holy Spirit. I also think that the christian way of getting along in this world is through the artistic gifts that are shared with other christians. Ive seen how when a person is brought into balance they learn how to enjoy their own expressions and know how the art opens up the soul in community. My highest experience in 7 years has been watching Godspell in a theater. Oh and sinner1 should have a hobbie... maybe start reading some novels .. that may be a way to satisfying your emotional life and just enjoy being yourself. Reply Quote Notify

1125	Forums / Theology Forum / Re: Dispensationalism	on: June 13, 2012, 10:07:35 AM
The Revelation is a description of the success of word and Spirit that connects heaven and earth through the prayers of the saints. There is no more practical instruction than this. Because just like we open our bibles and learn about the acts of God throughout all the generations of the earth so in heaven the Lamb opens the scroll and proceeds to act to rite the wrongs done by evil rulers and the abusive rich. The Revelation is a description of God who is behind the door working through His promises to do as He says. In matters of God opposing evil governments and economies of false scales the Revelation describes this eternal clash of great powers beyond our own ability to have any hope of retribution. We see God described in a way that is both beautiful and dangerous. And we get a sense that all of these events both future and past will find complete redemption through the means of faith whether here on earth or in the future eternal dwelling. This book presents an exalted view of God so that we are encouraged to focus our eyes on this throne. And we find that the more we look to God the more we are exposed to all of these attributes so that our natural response is to praise God as we focus on Him. We have a description of the working of evil in a society turned upside down. We see God who knows every abuse and as He describes this opposition in the destruction of creation and the abuse of men we find a Father who has planned the full protection of His elect. So that we will not be surprised when we see this evil communication and how it brings abuse to the nations and yet we see God act through our prayers that directly affect our personal protection. Not only are we drawn to look upon the beauty of God but we are embraced by a loving Father who has given us a glimpse of His work from the heavens on behalf of His elect. This is all so very practical.        1126  Forums / Break Room / Re: Touch hunger on: June 13, 2012, 08:37:59 AM I dont want to talk about touch and relationships because it gets into sexual areas and this is not the forum for this. But let me discuss counsel and relationships. Because as you know in memorizing the ot counsel book the amount of resistance that ive experienced from the christian world is eye opening and very much makes me question how far we have fallen. I wish there was someone else who memorized the wisdom books because i could get some agreement. And all of this disagreement is in the context of the how much authority the scripture has over our daily lives. Because in our world there is a tendency to view counseling and scripture as equals. This is done by making the practical applications in the epistles as absolute in all the areas we describe these practical matters in marriage, job, family, and children. Ive had a personal fight with people who teach that we are basically a mission to the world and they have said that the Psalms are not applicable in todays world. I ask where they get their mission doctrine? They tell me its from Acts. But did you know that Acts has more quotes from the Psalms than any other nt book?  The apostles were devoting themselves to these books and studied them daily. But we do not see the Psalms as an instruction book like a map. If you look in the epistles its presented before the practical instruction as the instruction for learning the gospel so that we know the wise way to treat each other. So the Psalms are like a Pilgrims progress that gives us a map on which road to go down and what signs to follow. Just look here at the apostles instructions. 19 speaking to one another with psalms, hymns, and songs from the Spirit. Sing and make music from your heart to the Lord, 20 always giving thanks to God the Father for everything, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ. Eph. 5 So we proceed in the name or authority of the Lord by speaking these Psalms. And then after you learn what road to proceed on you learn how to love in this society. Col 2 16 Let the message of Christ dwell among you richly as you teach and admonish one another with all wisdom through psalms, hymns, and songs from the Spirit, singing to God with gratitude in your hearts. And so here wisdom is only learned by the Psalms in order to act correctly with one another.  All of the admonitions of speech, unity in the body, husband and wives relationship, and all these other relationships are learned by comparing what is said in the Psalms with all other counsel of men.  In seeking to apply this method of success in this world i have been opposed at every turn.  Ive been accused of every evil that a person can possibly be accused of. And basically the fight is that i am trying to control other people, trying to get my way. But this is very simple to me. I am simply applying the wisdom of the Psalms with the modern day counsel. Ive been accused of being negative, of being angry, being one sided and not balanced. And yet the same people who are resisting my counsel are chaining these Psalms to the lectern of which the nt apostle encourages us to use . They are not opposing me but i simply am showing them what the bible says. So who is being extreme?     Reply Quote Notify 1127  Forums / Theology Forum / Re: Dispensationalism on: June 12, 2012, 02:36:28 PM Im not a dispensationalist but more of an amillenialist but i am also a realist. So i believe in two worlds. The created world and the eternal world. I am toying with the idea that the ot worship book..of which its wording is used in the rest of the ot ...is the parallel to the end times book Revelation. I am also thinking this Revelation is the nt worship book. I believe both of these books are set apart from the other books as a means to worship for the purpose of setting a standard of reformation so that these other books that describe the church are what is true in reality. I believe that the blessing of the Revelation is to set these 7 churches in order. The reason that i believe that Revelation is a nt worship book is to make worship something that is exalted as focused on the heavens and Gods rule over all time and creation. I believe that Edwards had a greater understanding of Revelation having a photographic memory and his writings especially... the end for which God created the world ...was from this worship mold of the Revelation. I think its very dangerous to use this book as a history book for the nt. Rather it was written to increase our faith that the means are how the world is run from the heavens. And so its a legal heavenly document that gives us a real picture of the working of these heavenly courts and how they interact with the events of this earth for all time. I believe that it should be read and studied as we do the Psalms. So i am a two world guy if there is a name for that. Reply Quote Notify 1128  Forums / Theology Forum / Re: The Covenant Avenging Sword: John Arrowsmith on: June 12, 2012, 12:23:27 PM And I will punish you yet seven for your sins, By seven understand many times, as when it is said, the barren hath borne seven, and that in dissemblers heart there are seven abominations: yet seven times, to wit, over and above what they suffered before, seven times more, as it is here v 18 and 21. It being that Lords manner of dealing to afflict lightly at first, but more grievously afterwards: where plaisters will not serve the turn, lancing may be looked for, if not dismembering. Scorpions use to follow rods, and yokes of iron to be put on after yokes of wood.  Hitherto of judgements in general, which the coherence hinted us to. Come we now to that particular in the text I will bring a Sword upon you, that shall avenge the quarrel of my Covenant. For the full improvement of which clause, may it please this Honorable and Christian Assembly to lend me attentive patient ears till I have opened and applied these three propositions. 1.War is a judgement of Gods own bringing. I will bring a sword. 2.The sword is an instrument of vengeance :A sword that shall avenge. 3.That which the sword comes to avenge , is some quarrel of Gods covenant. avenge the quarrel of my Covenant. To the first of these, Scripture gives frequent testimony: Ye have feared the sword, and I will bring a sword upon you, saith the Lord God. Ezech. 2 8 He it is that commands the sword go through such a land. Ezek. 14 7Its charge and commission comes from Him. Oh thou sword of the Lord, how long will it be thou be quiet? put up they self into thy scabbard, rest and be still. How can it be quiet, seeing the Lord hath given it a charge against Askelon, and against the sea shore? there hath he appointed it Jer. 47 To some it may perhaps seem that Saint James determines otherwise by what he hath left upon record, 4 1 from whence come wars and fighting's among you come they hence even of you lust that war in your members? And true it is that the next cause of most wars are lust of men. Remove Reply Quote Notify 1129  Forums / Theology Forum / Re: Being called home early due to sin.... on: June 12, 2012, 11:37:07 AM If you understand our relationship to Christ it is not just substitution but protection. And this is implied in His promise to love us. So in our experience of Christ substitution we are taught this in relationship to us as the image of Christ. So in a sense Christ cannot not be identified with us even when we sin. How can Christ be present with us when we sin and yet not destroy and unholy person according to our sin? He takes the place and became sin for us. He came as close as He could to actually being a sinner without Himself being a sinner. And so we always experience redemption because Christ has taken care of our enmity with our Father. This is why our health is always directed toward the desire for a longer life rather than the unnatural desire to commit suicide. So a wish can be unnatural. This is why we have not only a warning to avoid the reprobate in terms of their view of life but also the self righteous because both live with unnatural wishes. In other words those who live by the law will die by the law. So the law wishes death as a school master. The law is good by it cannot save. Or it cannot produce new life. And so God renews only those who violate the law. Because a wish to keep the law in the context of a legal spirit is the same thing as wishing to commit suicide. It is to hold onto the curses of shame, guilt, and sorrow. But we only keep our eyes on the goal of our faith to be more like Christ. So our wish is for life and longer life. This is why the only spiritual sustenance is Gods good promises and attributes to us. We are said to feast at Gods table and it being health to our bones. Because we live in the blessed state of renewal of our whole self. We are not something other than those who have been made complete and are being completed.  Reply Quote Notify 1130  Forums / Theology Forum / Re: TT.UU.LL.II.PP.s still bloom on: June 12, 2012, 11:16:57 AM What Kk is saying is that he actually agrees with me. If in fact God does not force the will but makes the will through pressure move from a state of indifference to accept salvation then in fact God chooses for man to choose. And if God chooses for man to choose then God actually chooses to choose man prior to man being indifferent. But Kk tries to say something and yet wishes something else. But if Kk is rite than we cannot say dogmatically that we are free from sin, given promises as the only way to change, only depending on the Spirit and word, and seeking only Christ to be in the context of Gods unfailing love. And this is where we distinguish not just in our clear differences but in how we are confident in our salvation. Because if in fact we are made to wrestle with God for our salvation then because God forces us He is a God who forces change as well. And so our sin, our addictions, our experience in the christian life is defined as humility needed to destroy pride with God being the winner. But we believe that Gods unfailing love is our only hope of having change. And so we do not worry about the power of sin or the presence of addiction but we simply appeal to God according to His promises on the basis of His unfailing love. What we are saying is that since God determined before hand to save us, not according to who we were, then He is seen as being most free to determine who He will choose. And since God is most free in His choice then He is unfailing in His love because God being free can be trusted when He says that He loves us by choosing us. And so no matter how much we struggle in this life and no matter how much we experience loss , we simply appeal to Gods unfailing love to fulfill His promises to us. Reply Quote Notify 1131  Forums / Main Forum / Re: Asking for forgiveness of sins. on: June 12, 2012, 11:01:52 AM Quote from: Gouda on June 12, 2012, 01:21:28 AM Willis, I by no means meant to imply there is not a New Covenant.  Besides the prophecies about it from Jesus and Paul, we can go to the prophecy several centuries before, by Isaiah. I just don't think we can dismiss the example our Lord gave us for how to pray. And that not by rote, but I think it still has value for wisdom in approaching God with the right attitude. It reminds us who is Holy, whose kingdom will prevail, who provides, who forgives (and we should do the same), who delivers us from evil, and to whom all the glory belongs.  It's basically a model like "When you pray, remember who you're talking to here..." I cannot think of anything that Jesus said before the cross that is no longer valid or useful, after the cross.  He wasn't caught unaware and unprepared to give an answer that stands the test of time.  He is the same yesterday, today, and forever. I think we error when we divide the Ot and say that it was past with the NT and say that it is more personal and instructive than the OT. But the Ot was God covenanting with men, the Nation of Israel as a God who rules all generations. God who does not change has order all things to work out by His counsel and those things we see in creation and recreation are Gods acts according to His statues, laws, decrees, judgments and promises. But within this interaction of heaven to earth , there is a history of redemption. So God acts in the same way but in types and shadows , that being a much smaller area of activity than the nt. So instead of the ot being obsolete it actually teaches the same redemptive artistic hand as the Nt but in a smaller way. So instead of God being made to look like He is different in the ot than the nt, He actually does those same things yet with more authority, power, glory, love, wisdom, wealth, strength, and honor. Reply Quote Notify 1132  Forums / Theology Forum / Re: The coming of the great Apocalypse on: June 12, 2012, 10:48:16 AM I cannot accept this Revelation as just being the present and future. Because it includes both the ot and new. There are so many clear references to the Ot in this Revelation. But my argument is that there was never a time when Christ was not involved in the major wars of nations. And this Revelation is God fulfilling His covenant promises that are part of the wording in the text. This Lamb of God provided eternal protection over all His church both Ot and Nt. And you see this Lamb in the ot as being the Lord of Glory who acted to defend Israel. His work of redemption is intricately woven in the military victories. Because there are some Psalms that include the entire description of the whole book of God as He rules from heaven in His statutes, laws, decrees, promises, and judgements.So that God provides for us a distinguishing of the clear paths the righteous and the wicked but God also explains His entering these events as in like of these two paths so that Gods path always rules from one generation to another. This Lord of Glory comes on the backs of the Cherubim , on the dark clouds of judgement in the great storms of creation. The saints cry out to God who promises to hear their cries as He comes to their rescue in the most trying times. And the language that is given to the saint is a blessed language that is purified seven times that meets the language of the wicked that is filled with schemes , threats, and violence. Because the saints are led by the language of Gods favor through His covenant promises to Abram. And this is exactly what Revelation is completing. Gods answers from the cries of His saints who cry out both nite and day for God to be an apocalyptic God. And so we see the interaction in heaven among the forces of heaven in their great power and glory of the beauty of heaven .As they are made ready to respond to the Psalmist cries. And this language of Revelation is a progressive revealing of what was not revealed in the ot.   Remove Reply Quote Notify 1133  Forums / Current Events / Re: Entitlement and Gratitude. on: June 11, 2012, 02:17:02 PM I know everyone likes to talk about our society is evolving from a republic to a socialist state. And i know there are many terms used to explain how we are slipping into this and what is necessary to reverse this. And i know how people are explaining this in terms of the answers they think will force everyone to be more motivated and self reliant. And i know all the terms used to apply these universal morals of self governing. But the bible teaches that whatever view we have of God is how we are gonna live in this world. And so our universal call is not to self reliance but its to glorify God by enjoying Him. This means that our message must get to the causes of why men refuse to let God rule. Because any nation is ruled by law but if men try to live according to the law they will die. And so all of our explanations of these things about one purpose in society is how we teach who God is. And we see that God is absolutely sovereign over this earth. He will not share His glory with any man. But God in His universal concern that men live in unity grants all that man has by grace. Without grace man would become a god unto himself. When men become gods then they defy Gods authority to be absolutely sovereign. God warns societies in which men govern by blindness and corruption. Because all men are born to be independent of god they devise schemes to to trap their neighbor. The reason they do not let God rule is because they believe that what they have is what they worked for and not a gift from God. Because real freedom is to give God the glory He deserves for the gifts He gives. The only other option is for man to take the glory for himself and thus seek to be his own god. As long as man seeks with his whole heart to glorify God then he is free to be a good citizen. Why is freedom given to man through grace rather than through achievement? Because there is no one good enough to be responsible enough to say that he is the one who is good in himself. But rather God is the one who has the absolute rite to give freely and to take it away. This is what motivates man to know freedom because he believes in a God who is absolutely free. This is why God must act prior to mans acting. Because God is the only one who is just and rite. God must work before man works. God must gift man before man is able. God must grant good gifts to man before man can be free to give them to others. In other words God must be seen as the one who works in order for the free exercise of our gifts are given for the glory of God. So that God alone according to our understanding of grace must be seen to work alone as who He is as being free and good. Because God is absolutely free to give and take away. God rejects the evil schemes of the wicked not because they do them immorally but because they do them for their own glory. You see the working principle that God has implemented does not allow any man to excuse himself from what he believes wrongly about God. But the man refuses to have the grace motive and thus destroys his neighbor.   Reply Quote Notify 1134  Forums / Main Forum / Re: Asking for forgiveness of sins. on: June 11, 2012, 11:45:39 AM This is the biblical way of saying that Gods forgiveness is successful. But the context is forgiveness verses debt. And i believe this is in a christian context because there is no outstanding debts for those who are in Christ. All of our debts have been cancelled. There is a sense in which the money borrowed is even a debt that we cannot hold against those in our present experience. The point is that God saves us because of His grace. So we extend this same grace in the community of grace. So there is no other working principle than God gifting us to gift others. And whatever those gifts are only bring us pleasure when we are using them for others in the christian context. So whatever we have was given to us by God as the means for building each other up. So this being the evidence of grace then how can we withhold the help if God has given us help through gifting us with His grace?Not all of us are gifted in the same areas. When someone is not sharing their gifts then those specific benefits of grace are not being used to connect redemption to individual salvation. So we should be using our gifts to help and encourage others. Reply Quote Notify 1135  Forums / Main Forum / Re: Truth… on: June 11, 2012, 10:29:44 AM God presented truth in the ot in the way of a lesson and that included not giving information purposely. And this is why i am a Calvinist because i believe that God leads people who are very broken and sinful. But God would never lead someone too fast where He would break the reed or the very skinny stick. The doctrine of God being our Shepherd is that what He ask us to do , He grants the ability.  So we are always focused on building each other up then we will not take this into our own hands and further injure someone. So if this is all very sensitive and unexplainable in terms of principles that are universal then what do we trust in? The only thing we can trust in is free grace. God grants us pardon in the covenant of grace so that we can be accepted when we fail. I mean, how simple and effective is this? This is what the Psalmist calls having one single purpose in life. It is to glorify God by enjoying Him forever. So the problem comes when people believe the wrong things about the doctrines of grace and become abusive. And there are people who think they understand these doctrines but they have never really thought about how to apply these as we see in the Psalms. This is learning wisdom so that we have a gift that doesnt require us to teach some people the same things we teach other people in our application. But we use wisdom from the maturity we have in applying the gospel in our own lives.   Reply Quote Notify 1136  Forums / Theology Forum / Re: Being called home early due to sin.... on: June 11, 2012, 10:06:33 AM The only remedy of drinking the cup worthily is to trust in Christ for the forgiveness of sins. Because the cup is for those who are christians, its a word of deliverance. But its not the juice or the bread but its our prayer to Christ in the full acknowledgement of His substitution for us. In light of this the author of Hebrews is not focusing on sin as that which separates us from the blessings. But rather its not acknowledging that in Christ we have forgiveness. And the author of Hebrews is further describing the benefits of Christ finished work on the cross. In other words the Jews were looking back in the ot in the teaching that God was a covenant keeping God , a God who was faithful but they did not have a full teaching that God was our Father. And so there needed to be clear teaching so that they would not be tempted to go back to the ot ceremonial system. So the author explains the doctrine that Christ actually brought us into a family. And because Christ did the work in His full substitution He not only forgave our sins but He acted in a family sense in pleasing the Father to be the older brother. In other words Christ is the giver of the inheritance but instead of an earthly inheritance Christ had everything placed under His feet and now being fully accepted as our High Priest we have a greater covenant promise of a heavenly inheritance.  And so the Jews were tempted to go back to something that was lesser had no power to be accepted in the beloved. And if they rejected Christ then there was no other hope. They would be rejected. Reply Quote Notify 1137  Forums / Theology Forum / Re: Re-forming reformed theology on: June 11, 2012, 08:57:16 AM http://www.oneplace.com/ministries/living-grace/player/sealing-problems-and-difficulties-284654.html Listen carefully to what Martyn says about Gods word. Reply Quote Notify 1138  Forums / Theology Forum / Re: Being called home early due to sin.... on: June 11, 2012, 08:50:09 AM cont. Let me give you a personal testimony. I suffered depression for about 2 years. And i was so distressed that i would cry out to God without any relief. I really did not think that i would ever find God in worship again. But the circumstances changed and i was delivered by the hand of God and was brought back to a praise that i could not dream of. And in fact i experienced a worship in the public sense that i could not describe. But this was short lived. Circumstances changed again and this kind of experience slowly faded away. I really believe that Satan worked to destroy this. I mean in a way that benefited how i am created.  But i never lose heart. Because i am promised that God has things that i could not imagine in the future. And He promises to those who call upon Him that He will never abandon us. I will be writing something cathartic in the days to come because i want to encourage others who suffer because of these evil days. I want to encourage people who are experiencing a kind of exile.   Reply Quote Notify 1139  Forums / Theology Forum / Re: Being called home early due to sin.... on: June 11, 2012, 08:29:32 AM I think there should always be a focus on doctrine first. And i always avoid the religious Phariseeism because I believe that we must hold fast to the gospel of grace. This is why the apostle says Cursed is everyone who preaches another gospel. And so we always are free if we come to Christ and confess our sins. The gospel is not for the righteous but for the unrighteous. When the world is turned upside down as in Jesus day it may be hard for us to find like minded friends who accept the full gospel. I really believe that a person who refuses to walk in the gospel was never a believer in the first place. And so that person would not continue holding fast to his confession. And so there  is no reason to expect forgiveness if the person considered Christ of no value. And if that is the case then the person curses themselves. We must always see that the curses are for those who want to live according to the law rather than seeking to be like minded in the encouragement that Christ alone is our only advocate. And so this is what the Psalmist says , that if we are enjoying forgiveness then we are to praise God in the mists of a crooked generation. In other words God seeks those who worship Him in spirit and in truth. And He will not turn away anyone who comes to Him. So this is the confession that is always in our hearts and on our lips. So if God is for us then who can be against us?  But we are required to only wish and encourage one another that blessing would come to us. As it says in the Lords prayer that no brother is to hold another brother as if it was required that there needed to be a payment. Because God forgives every christian freely. And so if we are entertaining an accusation against a brother then in a sense we are striving against Gods covenant love. So God has made it so that if we are enjoying forgiveness then we are free to forgive one another. All of these things must be personal to us or we would not be able to judge correctly. The Psalmist on the basis of Christ free pardon and His promise not to hold our sin against us considers that anyone who works against him is really outside of the covenant community and is cursed. Or is striving against  Gods covenant. This is what the Psalmist says. He acknowledges that if God were to hide himself from the Psalmist then he would be dismayed. Dismayed simply means to to break down the courage of completely to thoroughly be disheartened. And this means that a christian can experience extreme scorn. A non believer does not experience this. But a believer in experiencing this is made to draw close to the Lord by this motivation. And if you understand how ongoing sin and the experience of scorn works it causes you to long for a pure worship. This may go on for many years. We can pray for years and then the circumstances change and we experience a worship that is greater than what we thought God would bring us to. I think this is why in this day we see very little reformation because we just accept teaching that is wrong. We do not understand how we are opposed. But it really is hard to find a worship where we are rejoicing with joy unspeakable and full of glory. Most of the time what we enjoy is only for a short time and then Satan works to destroy that level of worship. It has been my experience that this kind of warfare in this day and age has many battles that are lost. In other words we have short victories.     Reply Quote Notify 1140  Forums / Theology Forum / Re: TT.UU.LL.II.PP.s still bloom on: June 09, 2012, 12:33:33 PM If you look in your ot in the Psalms is says in black and white.. there is no one righteous no not one, there is no one who seeks after God, all have turned aside. There is no one who does good. But then the Psalmist who is the king of Israel and is Gods anointed of whom it is said in the nt that this man does whatever i want him to do, this King who if you kept a record of sin then what man could stand? And he says do not judge me according to my sin. And yet he says that God has upheld his rite and his cause. What does this mean that a righteous king could be without hope of Gods help if God were to keep a record of His sins? Well the answer is how he approaches God in order to stand in a position of cursing his enemies and it being said that David did whatever i wanted. He says that God hates sinners but that David comes to God by His great mercy. He approaches God on the basis of the covenant God gave to Abraham. No were does this king of Isreal say that help me according to my intrinsic righteousness but he only pleads for his safety on the basis of Gods covenant love or Gods unfailing love. This means as the apostle says that Abraham did in order to be justified by faith and receive the righteousness that was foreign to every believer declared himself wicked. This same Abraham who all the ot saints appealed to as the basis of their enjoying Gods favor. This righteousness that came down out of heaven who is Jesus Christ. And so we see that this righteousness is two fold. Its a gift but its also Gods victorious work in His purposes to use people who are sinners for His glory. But God does not permit us to claim our own goodness but rather we acknowledge our bankruptcy and look to Christ righteousness as being victorious. And so this is why we are able to come boldly before the throne of grace and get justice on our behalf because God has promised to provide us with all that we need and so He is bound to Himself to fulfill His gracious promises to us.