I am having to deal with schizophrenia and
rage with an individual that is close to me. This is a physical problem.
So it has opened my eyes to some things that i had not considered. A
person can be subject to some dysfunction in the brain that can cause
them to be helpless. My observation is that this malady is mixed
with a genetic tendency in how the emotional structure of the problem
is worked out. In a way i believe that all people have a kind of
resistance to these workings in which they could be susceptible to
things in light of the health of their own spiritual immune system.
Along with the tendencies that are created by the personality. I
do not believe that the gospel can erase this entirely. But that it
gives a person the ability to go at a pace in which they are presented
with a healthy view of life while at the same time enjoying this
spiritual medication to dull the pain of the malady. I am speaking about
these tendencies as they relate to depression or other emotional
disturbances. Addiction is related to sin and sin is in our
members. These things are a mystery but they are related to our practice
from our youth. I do not believe that a person can entirely eliminate
these tendencies but i believe that the proper culture of doctrinal
wholeness is essential to finding victory and yet getting back up
immediately. Some of this association of guilt and shame is mixed with
anger and we fail to see the deeper issue so most of the time i find
people not hitting the mark about this. I think short term promises of
freedom are lies. I mean in the normal use of the means. I
offer this against the back drop of the efforts made to alleviate these
over burdening weights. There is a new effort to develop a community
that trades sins in for the matching uniforms. It is morally driven.
This is where things get messy. And i have learned by experience that
people do not have the same demands for intellectual satisfaction. For
instance some people who get into a desperate situation have a different
way of trying to find some normalcy. But there are trade offs in how it
is approached. I mean we are required to think differently as a way to
grow. So it is balanced with a natural desire to live a quality life
with our own responsibility to know our spiritual condition. Its Gods
responsibility to reveal these things along the way or its not God at
all.
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3243
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Forums / Theology Forum / Re: Hidden In God
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on: July 13, 2010, 10:26:29 AM
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mbG:
"Everyone is a sinner. That means there is a tendency to be as bad as
we possibly can. All people suffer from this tendency." K_k: I
have always tried to be a little less bad than i possibly can. I fail
often at this, of course, but i "keep the faith".  mbG: "We live a life in between guilt ... shame and love and acceptance. There is no in between state of personal redemption." K_k:
Positionally, perhaps. But, experiencially -- well that's a different
story -- a state of in-between-ness seems to rule, at least in this
life. Hopefully slanting toward the latter instead of the former, via
grace. mbG: "That is where all of these personal sorrows meet
His work and then we are renewed. It was done many yrs ago on the cross
and now it is finished. This is not serenity... this is true power and
victory." K_k: In serenity is true power and victory, since it
is merely fully trusting in Jesus and His completed/completing work in
our lives. But why quibble over words? One man's sereneness may be
another man's boredom. IF you know what i mean....
The
bible gives us the blue print for happiness. It is not a way that seems
right in our own eyes. But its a way that we must go if we are to endure
the troubles and sorrows of this life. Our sin will always be before us
because we will never find perfect sinless ness in this life. So we are
people who have been given this gracious disposition to know there is a
far greater weight of glory that awaits us while at the same time we
are concerned because of our sins. These sorrows of life are always
generated by a sense of helplessness and uncertainty. Because there are
many arrows that we are pierced with that produce this uncertainty in
how we are purposed to communicate on a level to others so that God will
get the glory. In a way we are all given to an imagination that our
personal troubles are our enemies and our appearance of righteousness is
the cause of our influence to others. But the world is a fallen
world and we are all put in this flow of divine immunation to work as
grace has caused us to a united hope as we identify with real sinners.
It is not what we appear to others... or what we say that will move us
one bit further to change but it is who we are and how we know ourselves
as God is working out the details of this unity. We are so identified
with Christ that we no longer live but Christ lives through us. We groan
inwardly because of the course of the world as we await our full
adoption as sons. This is why we are silenced before God. We must
conclude by our musing that there is no one who does good ... no not
one. So that we might be united in our view of community. Because we are
members of Christ body and we find in acknowledging that we are totally
corrupted then we are more able to bless our brothers without a vanity
that comes out of a feigned love. There is no reason to live in
condemnation. There is no place to find comfort in blame. There is no
reason to look at the past with an eye to regret. Because we all must
come to an end of our thinking that we live outside of the light of the
glory of God who is changing us from one glory to another out of a sense
of the free grace and mercy of Christ. Sin no longer defines how we
view time.
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3244
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Forums / Theology Forum / Re: Could Jesus have sinned?
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on: July 13, 2010, 10:00:11 AM
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Baptized
infants can grow up to be young adults who have never known Christ but
have always been told they are "christians". So why would they need a
Savior if they've already been "saved" at their infant baptism...
And satan pulls off another one.
Having
been on both sides of this issue it seems i can see how men become
entrenched in their particular orthodoxy. On the one side there is a
tendency to view this as focus on appearance. On the other side the
tendency is to place the ritual of baptism above the clear teaching of
the entrance into salvation by regeneration. Both of these extremes
comes from a lack of attention to the details of the order of salvation.
And that brings on a kind of exterior appearance of performing these
acts of righteousness in this social acceptance. This is why it is
good for us to study the two views of baptism as accepted among the
confessional community so that we can get a perspective of these
tendencies. Because most of the clear teachings of the doctrines of
grace historically have come from both views. There may be an
epistemological and dispositional comfort zone in the attraction to one
view over the other. I can see were infant baptism supports the
dispositional qualities of regeneration over the believers baptism.
Because we believe that it is not a matter of our confession that brings
about salvation but it is the secret work of the Holy Spirit by the
will of God alone given out of free grace to one who is like a child.
And yet we both teach that baptism must be accompanied by regeneration.
So that God is not limited to the act of baptism in order to work
salvation in a person.
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3245
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Forums / Politics Forum / Re: The incredible shrinking economy
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on: July 12, 2010, 07:58:09 PM
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"Many people who joined the middle class,
especially those who joined in the last few years, have now fallen back.
It's not over yet. Millions cannot make minimum payments on their
credit cards, or are in default or foreclosure on their mortgages, or
are on food stamps. Well over 100,000 people file for bankruptcy every
month. Some 3 million homeowners are estimated to face foreclosure this
year, on top of 2.8 million last year. Millions of homes are located
next to or near a foreclosed home, and it is the latter that may
determine the price of all the homes on the street. There have been
dramatically sharp declines in home equity, representing cumulative
losses in the trillions of dollars in what has long been the largest
asset on the average American family's balance sheet. Most of those who
lost their homes are hard-working, middle-class Americans who had lost
their jobs. Now many have to use credit cards to pay for essentials and
make ends meet, and they are running out of credit. Another $5 trillion
has been lost from pensions and savings."
Mort Zuckerman: Obama Is Barely Treading Water
The president's problem is simple: the economy and jobs
By Mortimer B. Zuckerman
Posted: July 2, 2010
Print
The
hope that fired up the election of Barack Obama has flickered out,
leaving a national mood of despair and disappointment. Americans are
dispirited over how wrong things are and uncertain they can be made
right again. Hope may have been a quick breakfast, but it has proved a
poor supper. A year and a half ago Obama was walking on water. Today he
is barely treading water. Then, his soaring rhetoric enraptured the
nation. Today, his speeches cannot lift him past a 45 percent approval
rating.
Click here to find out more!
There is a widespread
feeling that the government doesn't work, that it is incapable of
solving America's problems. Americans are fed up with Washington, fed up
with Wall Street, fed up with the necessary but ill-conceived stimulus
program, fed up with the misdirected healthcare program, and with pretty
much everything else. They are outraged and feel that the system is not
a level playing field, but is tilted against them. The millions of
unemployed feel abandoned by the president, by the Democratic Congress,
and by the Republicans.
The American people wanted change, and
who could blame them? But now there is no change they can believe in.
Sixty-two percent believe we are headed in the wrong direction—a record
during this administration. All the polls indicate that
anti-Washington, anti-incumbent sentiment is greater than it has been in
many years. For the first time, Obama's disapproval rating has topped
his approval rating. In a recent CBS News poll, there is a meager 15
percent approval rating for Congress. In all polls, voters who call
themselves independents have swung against the administration and
against incumbents.
Even some in Obama's base have turned, with
17 percent of Democrats disapproving of his job performance. Even more
telling is the excitement gap. Only 44 percent of those who voted for
him express high interest in this year's elections. That's a 38-point
drop from 2008. By contrast, 71 percent of those who voted Republican
last time express high interest in the midterm elections, above the
level at this stage in 2008. And these are the people who vote.
Republicans
are benefiting not because they have a credible or popular program—they
don't—but because they are not Democrats. In a recent Wall Street
Journal/NBC poll, nearly two thirds of those who favor Republican
control of Congress say they are motivated primarily by opposition to
Obama and Democratic policy. Disapproval of Congress is so widespread, a
recent Gallup poll suggests, that by a margin of almost two to one,
Americans would rather vote for a candidate with no experience than for
an incumbent. Throw the bums out is the mood. How could this have
happened so quickly?
The fundamental problem is starkly simple:
jobs and the deepening fear among the public that the American dream is
vanishing before their eyes. The economy's erratic improvement has
helped Wall Street but has brought little support to Main Street. Some
6.8 million people have been unemployed in the last year for six months
or longer. Their valuable skills are at risk, affecting their economic
productivity for years to come. Add to this despairing army the large
number of those only partially employed and those who have given up
their search for work, and we have cumulative totals in the tens of
millions.
Many people who joined the middle class, especially
those who joined in the last few years, have now fallen back. It's not
over yet. Millions cannot make minimum payments on their credit cards,
or are in default or foreclosure on their mortgages, or are on food
stamps. Well over 100,000 people file for bankruptcy every month. Some 3
million homeowners are estimated to face foreclosure this year, on top
of 2.8 million last year. Millions of homes are located next to or near a
foreclosed home, and it is the latter that may determine the price of
all the homes on the street. There have been dramatically sharp declines
in home equity
, representing cumulative losses in the trillions of
dollars in what has long been the largest asset on the average American
family's balance sheet. Most of those who lost their homes are
hard-working, middle-class Americans who had lost their jobs. Now many
have to use credit cards to pay for essentials and make ends meet, and
they are running out of credit. Another $5 trillion has been lost from
pensions and savings.
But it is jobs that have long represented
the stairway to upward mobility in America. For a long time, it was
feared they were vulnerable to offshore competition (and indeed still
are), but now the erosion is from economic decline at home. What happens
as those domestic opportunities recede? Middle-class families fear they
have become downwardly mobile and have not hit the bottom yet. The
financial security that was once based on home equity and a pension has
been swept away.
In a survey just released, the Pew Research
Center explored the recession's impact on households and how they are
changing their spending and saving behavior. Nearly half the adults
polled intend to boost their savings, cut their discretionary budgets,
and cut their debt loads. The report concludes that the present enforced
frugality will outlast the recession and its overhang. Fully 60 percent
of those ages 50 to 61 say they may delay retirement. What does that
mean for the young would-be employees entering the labor force over the
next few years.
The administration's stimulus program, because of
the way Congress put it together, has created far fewer jobs than
anyone expected given the huge price tag of almost $800 billion. It was
supposed to constrain unemployment at 8 percent, but the recession took
the rate way above that and in the process humbled the Obama presidency.
Some 25 million jobless or underemployed people now wish to work full
time, but few companies are ready to hire. No speech is going to change
that.
Little wonder there has been a gradual public
disillusionment. Little wonder people have come alive to the issue of
excess spending with entitlements out of control as far as the eye can
see. The hope was that Obama would focus on the economy and jobs. That
was the number one issue for the public—not healthcare. Yet the
president spent almost a year on a healthcare bill. Eighty-five percent
in one poll thought the great healthcare
crisis was about cost. It
was and is, but the president's bill was about extending coverage. It
did nothing about the first concern and focused mostly on the second.
Even worse, to win its approval he accepted the kind of scratch-my-back
deal-making that suggests corruption in the political process. And as a
result, Obama's promise to change "politics as usual" disappeared.
The
president failed to communicate the value of what he wants to
communicate. To a significant number of Americans, what came across was a
new president trying to do too much in a hurry and, at the same time,
radically change the equation of American life in favor of too much
government. This feeling is intensified by Obama's emotional distance
from the public. He conveys a coolness and detachment that limits the
number of people who feel connected to him.
Americans today
strongly support a pro-growth economic agenda that includes fiscal
discipline, limited government, and deficit reduction. They fear the
country is coming apart, while the novelty of Obama has worn off, along
with the power of his position as the non-Bush. His decline in
popularity has emboldened the opposition to try to block him at every
turn.
Historically, presidents with approval ratings below 50
percent—Obama is at 45—lose an average of 41 House seats in midterm
elections. This year, that would return the House of Representatives to
Republican control. The Democrats will suffer disproportionately from a
climate in which so many Americans are either dissatisfied or angry with
the government, for Democrats are in the large majority in both houses
and have to defend many more districts than Republicans. In any election
year, voters' feelings typically settle in by June. But now they are
being further hardened by the loose regulation that preceded the
poisonous oil spill—and the tardy government response.
The
promise of economic health that might salvage industries and jobs, and
provide a safety net, has proved illusory. The support for cutting
spending and cutting the deficit reflects in part the fact that the
American public feels the Obama-Congress spending program has not
worked. As for the healthcare reform bill, the most recent Rasmussen
survey indicates that 52 percent of the electorate supports repeal of
the measure—42 percent of them strongly.
It is clear that the
magical moment of Obama's campaign conveyed a spell that is now broken
in the context of the growing public disillusionment. Obama's rise has
been spectacular, but so too has been his fall.
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3249
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Forums / Theology Forum / Re: Could Jesus have sinned?
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on: July 08, 2010, 12:42:12 PM
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The
Jews considered the NT Greek language to be adequate to connect the OT
language to the NT... this is just like the pot calling the kettle
black.
Beside the fact that I don't even know what
you're referring to (your comment makes no sense); how do you know what
the Jews thought was adequate? Based on what information...historical
documents?, some ancient recordings? Or is that just your opinion base
on...what? The Jews used Greek to communicate with the
Hellenistic community but used the Hebrew scrolls in synagogue (Jesus
read from the Isiah scroll). They also used oral Aramaic paraphrased
scripture later called the Targums when committed to the written form. The
Vikings came much later and further away from Judea...around 700-900
AD. The word “Hell” comes from them (it's not a Greek or Hebrew word).
The English used the word when they translated the Bible and it's been
there ever since. The Word Hell, is misleading. Thor  Thor knows who Hel is!
Thor
as i recall these NT letters to the Jewish churches were written in
Greek with a little Aramaic. To a predominantly Jewish early church.
dont play dumb. Language is culture.
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3250
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Forums / Theology Forum / Re: Hidden In God
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on: July 08, 2010, 11:13:38 AM
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What i didn't make clear is that real serenity, not just the new age imitation, doesn't come from us.
Remember
the "serenity prayer"? It starts with "God grant me the serenity..."
It is His growing gift to us when we trust in Him. Apart from Christ's
empowerment, "serenity" a Hallmark-greeting-card-style, artificial peace
of mind which is superficial and temporary. And sometimes He grants it
to those who are just beginning to come to know Him -- then He is
humble and gracious enough to give it anonymously.
mbG: "This is
why God must teach us directly as an influence not only upon the
spiritual knowledge but how we live in that knowledge on a daily basis."
K_k:
He teaches us directly as an influence in our daily
spirit-knowing-lived-out, yes. It is His compassion for others, through
us, that teaches us what compassion is. His joy, through us, teaches
us more about what true joy is. His peace, in us, gives us new levels
of rest for our souls.
Everyone is a sinner. That means
there is a tendency to be as bad as we possibly can. All people suffer
from this tendency. There are things that we can change but we do not
have the ability to or the providential things available. Its not that
we have a divided ability. The problem is that we have things about
ourselves that we cannot change because we are in a constant state of
the laws condemnation. There is no man who is above being condemned for
not fulfilling his personal responsibilities to prove himself. We live a
life in between guilt ... shame and love and acceptance. There is no in
between state of personal redemption. We live before a holy God
who grants us life out of mercy. That means that every breath we take
is breathed in by a condemned man and it is expelled as
irresponsibility. We enjoy peace... love... acceptance ... and
qualification as a proof out of Gods forgiveness. So that our guilt
meets His suffering and we have peace. No other foundation is available
to us. There is many voices that parade themselves before our
ears. There are many words that we hear that present themselves as
alternatives. But our fall back position is very simple. Salvation is in
God alone! That means that we take the position that earning is from a
sense of personal attainment from our doing something to receive a
paradigm of spiritual understanding. But grace requires us to see the
mystery as the attraction. That is where all of these personal sorrows
meet His work and then we are renewed. It was done many yrs ago on the
cross and now it is finished. This is not serenity... this is true power
and victory.
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3252
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Forums / Theology Forum / Re: Hidden In God
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on: July 08, 2010, 10:32:09 AM
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We are seeking to leave this world for a time. The way to spiritual
transformation is treating this world as a fickle friend. Its seeing
with spiritual eyes. We live a life of faith. . . the world wants
us to live by sight. Faith is something that we acquire by a gift.
We can not find it in any other connection on this earth. It comes to
us directly. I mean faith as defining our better view of things.
We
are walking down this long hall way. The world is at our backs. We
are fleeing this world because it is cursed. We see the blessings of
all of the good things in another world. Every cursed spirit is trying
to force us into a connection to this world that would hold us in its
power. We are free people. The world is a world of bondage. Thats
why we groan inwardly. Because the world swallows people up into its
system with the Prince and power of the air and it draws people into
powers that are seducing. It makes a man focus on things that are in
close connection to an impossible set of standards. Because the world
offers a wage for a payment. You pay with your life and you get a
measly wage. In the world there is no such thing as eternity. It is
who gets the most toys wins. These massive wages hold men under the
power of their own lust! But comparative to the wages of eternity they
are miserly.
So that we always want to get out of this world
in order to be free to live in another world. We long to see Jesus.
So we groan in a way that we would flee to our mountain and these
mountains of reality are actual views we have of not being under the
domination of men or things even tho they try to force us to feel a
certain way in the transaction. We are living a life of no
condemnation.
That is why we belong to another world. Because
the men in this world look at us and they say. . you cannot possibly
be realistic in your being poor in this world. You are a dunce. To
which we say. . . How can you shake your finger in the face of God?
Now i tell you with all of my heart. . . seek His face . . .
flee from the wrath to come! You have no power over my life. . . it
is hidden in God! When we see our Kings face then the light of the glory
of God. . . that which is more valuable than anything in this
world. . it shines in our faces. It makes our countenance unlike
anything transparent in this world! This is why when we call on our
great deliver from the world we receive better than we could ever ask or
think. The world offers wages that are burdens. . . God gives us
things that are beyond our pay scale! Is your life hidden in God? Do you
feel like a foreigner in this world? Are you all alone in God?
Seems perfect to me cheap e cigarettes online
Is
this an agreement of my position or a "oh... you just are so heavenly
minded you are no earthly good" philosophy? I need more words. I wont
bite. I admit i use to love those candy cigs...hehe
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3253
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Forums / Theology Forum / Re: Could Jesus have sinned?
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on: July 08, 2010, 10:25:46 AM
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Speaking of Creeds. . . I am wondering how many of you agree with the
Apostles Creed where it says Christ descended into Hell. I had looked
forever it seems to find out if that was scriptural or not. . . . but
could only find "belly of the earth" in First or 2nd Peter but nothing
solidly conclusive about this. Any takers on that one??
First of all, thank you for the kind words. Hmm... From He Descended into HellBut
whatever interpretation one accepts, the scriptural passages upon which
this teaching is based must be studied closely. Some of the standard
texts are Job 38:17, Psalm 68:18-22; Matthew 12:38-41; Acts 2:22-32;
Romans 10:7; Ephesians 4:7-10, 1 Peter 3:18-20, and 1 Peter 4:6.So
the net is that Jesus went down and proclaimed victory to the spirits
imprisoned in Tartarus, then released the Old Testament saints from
Sheol and ascended into Heaven with them in tow. Okay, I can see how
the creed-writers got that.
Remember the word "Hell"
is a borrowed word from the viking Saxons who conquered Britain and
supplanted much of their language with their own. Hell or Hel is the
Viking goddess of their underworld. Hell is actual not even a Biblical
word...just a borrowed one with all its conflicting meanings added.
That's why you have to understand the underlying Greek, Hebrew and
Aramaic words. Many Christian teachers are worthless in explaining a lot of these things and just perpetuate confusion in the pews. Thor
The
Jews considered the NT Greek language to be adequate to connect the OT
language to the NT... this is just like the pot calling the kettle
black.
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3255
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Forums / Theology Forum / Re: Could Jesus have sinned?
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on: July 07, 2010, 05:45:32 PM
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Chalcedonian Creed
We, then,
following the holy Fathers, all with one consent, teach people to
confess one and the same Son, our Lord Jesus Christ, the same perfect in
Godhead and also perfect in manhood;
truly God and truly man, of a reasonable [rational] soul and body;
consubstantial [co-essential] with the Father according to the Godhead, and consubstantial with us according to the Manhood;
in all things like unto us, without sin;
begotten before all ages of the Father according to the Godhead, and
in these latter days, for us and for our salvation, born of the Virgin
Mary, the Mother of God, according to the Manhood;
one and the same Christ, Son, Lord, only begotten, to be acknowledged in two natures, inconfusedly, unchangeably, indivisibly, inseparably;
the distinction of natures being by no means taken away by the union,
but rather the property of each nature being preserved, and concurring
in one Person and one Subsistence, not parted or divided into two
persons, but one and the same Son, and only begotten, God the Word, the
Lord Jesus Christ;
as the prophets from the beginning [have
declared] concerning Him, and the Lord Jesus Christ Himself has taught
us, and the Creed of the holy Fathers has handed down to us.
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sanctification, and 9) glorification. (Rom 8:29-30)
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