1846	Members Only / Purgatory / Re: The Art of War	on: December 15, 2011, 12:39:41 PM
Kk does not like this because Kk thinks we need to do the 12 steps instead of asking directly to God to bless the righteous and destroy the wicked. Kk thinks he has some special redemption powers in making men his disciples. lol But we know that freedom comes when the righteous get what the desire and the wicked are thwarted. We know there is a real struggle between good and evil. But Kk thinks that Gods general love gives him the power to gift men with the mentality of the steps in order to show them grace. lol His words...not mine. We know that God blesses us as the love He shows us. So we are all cheer leaders for one another. We are a community not connected by word or principle but by Spirit. So we are only empowered to be a help to our brothers in connecting them to success. But if we fail to be the encourager and we try to do what the Spirit is only able to do then we are really cursing ourselves. We are living with an imagined power. We have not trusted in God alone. We do not believe that God produces our honor but we think that we can make God to be honored.
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1847  Forums / Theology Forum / Re: Genuine saving faith - Passing the tests on: December 15, 2011, 12:24:30 PM People today do not like to think. They want to be told the five steps to something. The bible says that we should seek for wisdom... divine wisdom not mans wisdom.. .like we dig for gold. We should find our joy that is promised to us in uncovering spiritual truth through illumination like it is the only thing we do. If we divide our lives up then we will never do a good thing. So we only seek one thing...this one thing i seek... that i may dwell in your house forever and ever... gaze on the beauty of the Lord. He promise that if we seek Him first .. then all these things will be added unto you. Seeking is definite and not general . Because seeking is Him gifting us with gifting others. This is the only power we have to extend our gifts to others. Its called gospel power. The art of seeking is in the focus. The focus is like a tree that we have in which we experience new life and this breeds success. Freedom attracts people who are enslaved. Then we do not show them what we do but we are what we want them to be. lol We at no time look outside of our selves and try to produce our own image. That is called controlling . Do not worry about your life. What you will do. Instead we forget about ourselves by experiencing Gods mysterious influence. We are happiest when we are in Gods presence. His light shines in our face and we are bold as lions. We are apologist who communicate in such a way that we order the reality of freedom in our culture. Reply Quote Notify

1848  Forums / Theology Forum / Re: Genuine saving faith - Passing the tests on: December 15, 2011, 12:06:50 PM Bill i think there is a tendency to take discipleship to an extreme. I ve seen it create a bad dependence on people. There is a balance between our responsibility and seeing the real person we are encouraging. A lot of this one size fits all is really just controlling. If we need to talk to someone before we decide what to do then that is really dangerous. We should be free to develop our own style.  A lot of this stuff today is engrained senseless lack of courage to teach people how to think for themselves and be able to do all the negative things out of that common sense. Ive seen people try to make everything the same. And they try to eliminate negative and truth telling in order to look successful. There is a lot of dangerous stuff out there. Bill i believe its because people have no individualism that is only learned in a family environment. You cant short cut growth and call it a success. To be honest this should take the negative inward experience as fuel for doing something extra ordinary.      Reply Quote Notify

1849  Forums / Theology Forum / Re: Genuine saving faith - Passing the tests on: December 15, 2011, 11:48:49 AM God gave us years of fruit bearing ... that we had real freedom to explore the education of our kids in enjoying homeschooling not only in our own family but it spread throughout this community. At the same time God gave me work in order to create this vision. I do not think at any time it was a chore. It was all enjoyment. It was as natural as enjoying God. And my son is the blessing out of that joy. Life is always lived in our own minds and then God blesses what we are. We have so much in doing it Gods way. And it is not burdensome. I only have good memories of those yrs. And i enjoy the memories as if i had a bigger family when i see these kids from this group grow up to be valuable. God has blessed me more of seeing the fruit than in enjoying the kids. Its hard for me to put this blessed freedom into words. Reply Quote Notify

1850  Forums / Theology Forum / Re: Genuine saving faith - Passing the tests on: December 15, 2011, 11:44:22 AM Ive been meditating most of my young adult life. I do not think i had another goal in life but to consume scripture. But what happened from this was somethings that were added to my life that i consciously did not think as a goal. And some things i like and disliked. But i was led down a path through experiencing freedom and then creating the society that was envisioned out of that. I really believe that cursing led to protection in this creation. I believe prayer was the engine of my success. My wife bless her heart. Reply Quote Notify

1851  Forums / Theology Forum / Re: Genuine saving faith - Passing the tests on: December 15, 2011, 11:29:00 AM Bill since the last time you left i have become more of a states men not that i am good that this but its become clear to me that God orders our lives through His work in nations. And i do not just feel a sense of anger over the way that we sell religion but in the general abuse that i see happening now that i did not experience. I constantly apologize to the kids of what i see them having to endure. Its just makes me weep. Reply Quote Notify

1852  Forums / Theology Forum / Re: Genuine saving faith - Passing the tests on: December 15, 2011, 11:22:12 AM Quote from: billbennett on December 15, 2011, 11:15:27 AM Quote In fact if we ask God for anything it is not in the context of what we deserve but its what we need and what we do not deserve. God will not break the smoldering flax. This is man at his best. Man coming to God, completely dependent upon His grace and mercy. As the old hymn states "nothing in my hands I bring, only to thy cross I cling" . Tom where does man's responsibility for availing himself of the means of grace provided by God fit in, specifically in regards to sanctification. Can we hinder the process by not spending time in His word, in prayer, worship ect. Or do the desires for growth and maturity come from Him as well? I think of the scripture that says "desire the sinere milk of the word that you may grow thereby". Interested in your thoughts. Love you brother and it is good to be back. Your posts are always an encouragement. Bill Bill i think its two fold. I know a lot of believers that are just waxed cold by the level of evil and the sorrow of secret cries in the cities of our nation. Ive come to see that it is even an experience in our churches. They have strayed away from the first love principles. A lot of our religion has been institutionalized. When we do not focus on the gospel of grace through His word we begin to stray. Because God must provide the basis of His proving that He is faithful by speaking to us through word and Spirit. But at the same time i am seeing young people being put to two or three jobs and this is not like the 1940s where we had a better understanding of patriarchal prosperity.  What we are seeing is the abandoning of our most weakest link. We are seeing the exercise of authority as like fascism. I mean in the average experience. God is faithful and we can live above this experience but we really do experience the adversity that is making men weak and ineffective in their lives .This is a very bad time in my opinion.... Reply Quote Notify

1853  Forums / Theology Forum / Re: Mind Renewal Through Transparency : The Psychology of Life on: December 15, 2011, 11:08:28 AM We need to get rid of this individual focus of salvation. That we are subject to evil spirits and the enemy is just the personal Satan. We are in a world where the devils are men who are the personality of Satan. The interaction of people is real. The total nature of evil is the individual struggle with individuals. We do not live in a general welfare guaranteed by our constitution. This nation was founded on the eternal foundations of Gods law! Listen these things that we experience in our relationships have a direct connection to the knowledge when we compare what God demands with the state of our nation! Now listen we are under the curse of God. The marriage rate of the younger generation is just 13 percent. Do you know what this means people? This is like taking a b-omb and blowing up the security of a nation! Remove Reply Quote Notify

1854  Forums / Theology Forum / Re: Genuine saving faith - Passing the tests on: December 15, 2011, 10:53:25 AM People have a warped view of God as being holy. God does not present Himself as being totally other.. behind the door in heaven and not interacting with men. But He is more ...even in the ot promises to condescend to sinners. In other words God gifts men with His attributes that are for mans deliverance not judgement. But God is also very much an avenger of His elect. There is very little about God confronting His elect. In fact if we ask God for anything it is not in the context of what we deserve but its what we need and what we do not deserve. God will not break the smoldering flax. This is man at his best. But God gifts men to prove that He saves by grace. We describe this love as a great love because its compared to the faithlessness and fickleness of men. Every man... no matter who his name is or what position he stands is just a sinner among other sinners. What makes him look more important than other sinners is his tendency to scheme. lol... yes to sell himself. So God must describe His message as proving His holiness by destroying men in their power. This is why we look at God as being faithful and great. Because He will not allow men to declare their independence in this great scheme of wicked authority that is exercised on this earth.   Reply Quote Notify

1855  Forums / Theology Forum / Re: Genuine saving faith - Passing the tests on: December 15, 2011, 10:38:44 AM Quote from: billbennett on December 15, 2011, 10:30:55 AM Quote we must focus on salvation and not on our behavior that proves salvation Exactly Tom. Here is a story that is true in my own life, but I have heard Steve Brown use as an illustration as well. When I married Linda now almost 20 years ago, I did not know how to dance. But seeing how much she enjoyed dancing, I decided to try and learn. My first efforts were very painful, both to me and her! One time we were dancing and she said "Bill, stop looking at your feet and listen to the music, just feel the music and dance". I am still not much of a dancer, but I got the point. Now the application, we can keep looking at our feet spiritually (the rules, the Law) or we can be filled with God's Spirit and allow Christ to live in us, and through us to others. In others words, dance. In Him.  And someday something will happen that will surprise even yourself. You will be patient instead of rude, loving instead of sarcastic, ect. And you will realize, it was Him all along. In us, through us. In the meantime, to quote Steve Brown, you don't criticize his game when you see a dog playing checkers. You are just amazed that he is playing at all. Bill Love it Bill... the fire is still burning my brother. Reply Quote Notify

1856  Forums / Theology Forum / Re: Genuine saving faith - Passing the tests on: December 15, 2011, 10:36:02 AM Our present religious teaching in this nation is universal love of God. There is not much about the covenant love of God or the particular love of God. The covenant of grace was one sided not two. In starting from grace we are not in a saving process of demands but of promises. I do not agree with the universalism of todays message. God has a covenant of curses and blessings.  When we are given the gift of faith it is through grace alone. We now stand with God who looks at us as without condemnation of the law. Instead of condemning us God stands as our advocate. In other words we get better by God being faithful to real sinners. God now becomes our Father and He proclaims blessing over our lives by standing in Christ as our lawyer. He proclaims a loaded question to the world. WHO SHALL BRING ANY CHARGE AGAINST MY ELECT? WHO IS HE THAT CONDEMNS? In other words God as Father actively goes before us to create a way of success. Now listen we go on the basis of what He says and not what we do!   Reply Quote Notify

1857  Forums / Theology Forum / Re: Genuine saving faith - Passing the tests on: December 15, 2011, 10:15:31 AM Quote from: billbennett on December 15, 2011, 09:19:33 AM Sigh.... This thread illustrates why I am so dogmatic about what I am convinced is the error of "Lordship Salvation" espoused by McArthur and others. Salvation is either by grace through faith or by works not a mixture of the two. Either the finished work of Christ on the cross and His ressurection is sufficient for my salvation or I am forever lost, without hope and undone. Those who fail to seperate the free gift of salvation through faith in Christ and the stringent demands of following Christ are making a critical error in interpreting scripture. The result is causing genuine believers new to the faith to doubt their salvation because they don't "measure up". Let me put this very simply. If you have trusted in Christ for your salvation you are a child of God. Forgiven totally, clothed in the righteousness of Christ, perfect in God's sight. You can never be seperated from the love of God that is in Christ Jesus. Never. So dance !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I agree with you Bill ...we must focus on salvation and not on our behavior that proves salvation. We are not intrinsically sinless until we get to heaven. So there is never a time when we approach God through finding acceptance. The point of the descriptions of the saints is to prove that the world is blind. Who cares about these standards when they do not know Christ? We start from the position of knowing our sin as the standard of knowing Christ. Not our righteousness.   Reply Quote Notify

1858  Forums / Theology Forum / Re: Satan, Demons, and Dogmatism on: December 15, 2011, 10:08:22 AM Calvinism delivers us from looking for salvation in someone or something else. Because Calvinism eliminates the need to explain pain through a mediator other then Christ. So Calvinism prevents men from using authority they do not have as it puts limits on by Gods sovereign grace. Let me say that all men are in a deep mire of pain and their only alternative in getting redemption from the pain is to outlast he other guy and make their name respectable. This is why Calvinism stops men from working to destroy other men. It stops at the reality of the pain that is produced through curses. Calvinism describes the end of all men before they are born. It does not stray from real reality. It leaves every event in this world in Gods hands. This is the only way to prove that men have no authority to atone for sin and thus to deal with a persons pain. Everyone is forced to see God as working in behalf of real sinners . It eliminates the focus on the methods that cannot deliver a man. Let me say that i do not think we are talking about the consequences of pain that move us to a position of direct conflict with the truth of scripture but i think its makes us focus on things that do not matter. This is Calvinism... a man is forced into an image of the truth by his misrepresentation of the gospel of grace. This just does not happen in the education of a man but it happens by a life in dealing with pain. Men will not find solace in being lifted above their pain... in some ways deflecting their sinful course in favor of Gods sovereign rite to allow for weakness in order to focus on redemption as the mechanism of deliverance. But men will always scheme against God in the name of success to produce a utopia and force God out through false images of the real thing. If a man does not experience truth as it is that leads to the experience of mystery then he is a self made man.    Remove Reply Quote Notify

1859  Forums / Theology Forum / Re: Satan, Demons, and Dogmatism on: December 15, 2011, 08:38:02 AM The war of the world is a war of words. Because whatever a man thinks in his heart .. so is he. The natural mind uses his own powers to advance his own agenda. He works from the principle that pain produces deliverance. This is how he delivers himself! He teaches that pain is good but what man is blind to his own pain in believing that personal pain is of the devil. The other guy needs the pain. Man in his natural thinking patterns is very simple. Although how he reacts to the events of life is complicated yet he works from the principle of works for deliverance. Ive heard this that Billy needs to learn a lesson from God in order to have a reality check and come to his senses. Now listen this is man in his natural works oriented view of life. The law of God does not give the ability to be delivered by working to bring a man to his senses. The law of God is a tool used by the wicked to describe a world view of pain producing profit. But its not personal pain! They are blind to their own weakness and tendency to meet disaster. The law does not advance social order. The law curses sinners. Men to not create pain but God orders mens hearts to experience pain. Because pain is a destructive curse on the human race because of sin. If pain was necessary to advance the renewal of all things then God would use pain in the eternal state. We must see that pain is like an evil man that is in the house so to speak. Pain is the dogma of destruction. Life is in reality fighting pain. Pain never goes away. It is the adversary we are confronted with as long as we are conscious. Pain is a curse.The by product of the law is curses and the curses are the pain in the experience. God is the only one who knows our pain. No man can read the pain we experience. God is the only one who can put his hands around our pain.. under our pain... through our pain. God sees the meta physical pain. Our problems are not that we need pain in order to be changed but that we have pain and we do not describe it or think it is common to the other guy. Did you ever think that you were a person who was like a prisoner.. locked up in your own pain? Every man is a prisoner to his own pain. The problem with men is they are blind to other mens pain. They are locked up inside their own pain in their heads. This creates all kind of illusions about reality. Because there is not hope of men being able to connect with other men as it really is. Men can only seek to identify with pain by their own experience. This is why men try to box up pain and explain it. Because they do not understand it outside of the context of their own pain. Now listen to me... all men view life through the prison of their own pain. They will do all kinds of things with all kinds of motives to prove their worth over acknowledging their pain and Gods rite as the only real source of knowledge of their pain. They will not come to terms that God alone is the author of pain and it produces in them a single desire to approach God as He is sovereign... they deflect their pain and in doing this they retreat from dogma. I am simply talking about universal sin and not the relationship between christian identity and curses.      Remove Reply Quote Notify

1860	Forums / Theology Forum / Re: Genuine saving faith - Passing the tests	on: December 15, 2011, 07:21:53 AM
1 john 4 2 This is how you can recognize the Spirit of God: Every spirit that acknowledges that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is from God, 3 but every spirit that does not acknowledge Jesus is not from God. Here is the standard of the gospel of grace. The other things are a by product of our holding to this confession. Its so simple we miss it.  Do not reduce salvation to a set of principles. John talks about growth as going from children to fathers.. going from words and laws to the actual person... dont put salvation in a box.     1861  Forums / Theology Forum / Satan, Demons, and Dogmatism on: December 15, 2011, 07:05:10 AM The world of reality is defined by two opposing world views. On the one side you have the communication of deliverance and one the other side you have the communication of destruction. I remember a number of years ago i was suffering mental anguish. I can remember that whatever i was thinking was mixed with pain and anguish. I had this war going on in my thinking. It was my meditation on the Psalms and holding onto this dogma with giving in and giving up. Every time I began to meditate i experience the most extreme war of pain and anguish. It was a time where i could have given up my desire to be as dogmatic as i possibly could. It was a war in my mind that had two opposing world views. This took a lot of my energy. I would battle to focus on salvation and in doing this i experience sever pain. I spent hours focusing on the dogma of salvation. I would have the most awful bouts of unbelief where i would feel that there was no real salvation. But i was determined to fight until i died if so be. This taught me something about this life. If i gave into believing that i needed something else to save me then i would embrace other things. I really hated the dogma of the doctrines of grace. But i fought my own lack of conviction to overcome this. But it was not really any thing other then God was teaching me to not turn to the rite or to the left. He was teaching me that if i embraced truth and would not let it go because of the struggle then that dogma would protect me. Now i love to be single minded. I am going to describe the problems we have with looking at this experience and how pain makes cowards out of us all. We look for things to save us that have no power. We blame people for our problems and spend half our lives thinking that we are balanced. Listen its almost impossible to hold onto the truth in this life without an intense inward struggle. The only thing that we focus on is the gospel of grace. Men will us evil for their own benefit. They will attribute evil beings as a kind of protection of their particular schemes. They did this to Christ. They said that He had demons who performed His miracles. Now listen... pain makes us a coward. People will use other men, the spiritual evil to protect themselves from having to bow down to the dogma of salvation... Mental pain is really our fight to hold onto the clear teachings of scripture and to stand our ground. Sometimes the war is in  standing our ground. Its not in advancing. You got to be labeled crazy in the worlds eyes to embrace this dogmatism... Reply Quote Notify 1862  Forums / Theology Forum / Re: Freedom of the Will.... J. Edwards on: December 15, 2011, 05:52:33 AM Quote from: Kings_kid on December 15, 2011, 12:13:37 AM I hope Edwards finally gets around to the fact that God gives mankind a will that is free to reject Him as long as the person can resist His advances, and still draws many to Himself without force or coercion.  You havent even comprehended what Edwards is saying... lol Remove Reply Quote Notify 1863  Forums / Theology Forum / Re: Spiritual Experiences on: December 15, 2011, 05:51:07 AM Quote from: Kings_kid on December 15, 2011, 12:42:24 AM Quote from: mybigGod on December 14, 2011, 02:51:26 PM Kk until you give up control of you life to Christ alone you will just trust in quoting scripture. Your usage of scripture is equal to kks philosophy of healing. Giving up control is giving up your focus on trying to convict other people through your using scripture. Its being able to get rid of all the agendas and and teach the gospel from what Christ gives you. There are not steps.. there are no other agendas you bring to the scripture. The only people who have this kind of world view are those who know God not by the word or book but by experience. Thats why not many should want to be teachers. I can see a person twist the small things because they have an agenda. It doesnt impress God.   Christ is in control of my life, and has been doing an amazing job of revealing His patience and kindness, as well as His ability to transform.  He's made it clear that i can't convict anyone, with or without using Scripture.  But i still get to share whatever Bible passages are inspired at the time -- what He does with them is up to Him. The steps are not an agenda, but an integral part of the Word, since they come from Scripture, and are the path He has laid out.  Your inability to see them in the Bible is understandable, since you seem to have had some bad experiences in recovery groups.  But if you look more closely at the principles you will see that you also do the same things, as do all Believers. Don't let your prejudice shut you off from what is available to see in those parts of Scripture.  Christ is much more gracious than your perceived limitations of Him.  Drunks don't recover themselves by "working steps", they are like prodigal sons, drawn and molded and shaped by the merciful Healer, and given a job of reaching out to others of like condition. Kk You understand your philosophy of addiction but you drop the ball when we talk about biblical doctrine. You should be as concerned for what God says as what you consider successful. Its the difference between God actually being present or someone trusting in a mystical power. Mystical powers are sooooo destructive. Remove Reply Quote Notify 1864  Forums / Theology Forum / Re: Spiritual Experiences on: December 14, 2011, 02:51:26 PM Kk until you give up control of you life to Christ alone you will just trust in quoting scripture. Your usage of scripture is equal to kks philosophy of healing. Giving up control is giving up your focus on trying to convict other people through your using scripture. Its being able to get rid of all the agendas and and teach the gospel from what Christ gives you. There are not steps.. there are no other agendas you bring to the scripture. The only people who have this kind of world view are those who know God not by the word or book but by experience. Thats why not many should want to be teachers. I can see a person twist the small things because they have an agenda. It doesnt impress God.  Remove Reply Quote Notify 1865  Members Only / Purgatory / Re: The Art of War on: December 14, 2011, 02:30:14 PM Quote from: another beloved child of HIS on December 14, 2011, 11:18:43 AM Why is this thread in Purgatory? Because not everyone agrees with this hateful response to the problems of this life. People get really nervous when we talk about hating. But I need to show what the scriptures say after meditating on this for a long time. Its not dangerous at all.. the hidden social disorder is this anger that everyone experiences as self defeating. People may think i am talking about psychology. But i am not talking about what we do in horizontal relationships. Remove Reply Quote Notify 1866  Forums / Theology Forum / Re: Genuine saving faith - Passing the tests on: December 14, 2011, 02:23:30 PM I believe the problem "that you have arrived" is worse than the problem of not passing.. 1 jn 1 8 If we claim to be without sin, we deceive ourselves and the truth is not in us. 9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just and will forgive us our sins and purify us from all unrighteousness. 10 If we claim we have not sinned, we make him out to be a liar and his word is not in us. The point is that the test is to be confessing that we are a sinner not just doing sins. The point of the test is that because we confess that we are sinners then we need the gospel of grace.  Reply Quote Notify 1867  Forums / Theology Forum / Re: Free Grace Freedom on: December 14, 2011, 10:23:59 AM You know ive been doing this meditation for 30 yrs.. Its amazing to me that someone can read a passage in the book and lecture me on why i am wrong about my position on grace. Ive got all of these other verses rolling around in my noggin and some of these people havent read these verses in 10 yrs. You know theres a big disconnect between systematic ways of bible interpretation and actually interpreting the verses in light of the surrounding verses. Its very difficult for me because i do not have a degree in theology. And yet ive not only experienced this in the christian community but in my business relationships that people who are gifted get taken advantage of. If someone makes it look easy it doesnt translate into respect but a kind of suspicion. im free.. lol Remove Reply Quote Notify 1868  Forums / Theology Forum / Re: Free Grace Freedom on: December 14, 2011, 09:56:35 AM People who are closes to me have said they have not seen someone as free as me. Why is this? Because i understand grace. It has nothing to do with any other things. It amazes me that people want to get into my personal business and tell me that the gospel is more than grace. They act as if their counsel is the gospel of truth. Now listen to me... i am free... i am free!!! Dont try to mold me into what you think i should be. Dont get in my business. I get to decide what relationships are important to me! If i want to seek any thing i will decide to. I know its hard .. you want to bring me back under the law. You want me to be circumcised so that you can boast about your success with me. Listen i dont need your help...lol. Lets get all these side issues put in the proper place. Lets talk about grace. Lets encourage each other so that we will be moved to love our God. Get off of your soap box! I really dont care.. i may be able to teach you something... im free.   Remove Reply Quote Notify 1869  Forums / Theology Forum / Re: Spiritual Experiences on: December 14, 2011, 08:34:16 AM Spiritual experiences are the overflow of His word becoming reality. The experience is grace coming alive in us. Experiences are as powerful as the word understood by our minds. They create a context in us that the reality of God ruling the universe is flowing toward the end to bring Him glory. We are drawn to a new communication that goes beyond just book knowledge. But God gives us a spirit of understanding in which we form our words in a multitude of ways with all kinds of spiritual visions of grace. These experiences that are given us have a longing for more of God that we cannot write in words.The word of God in coming alive becomes to us a sweet experience. We feel that there is something in our presence that is like a breeze or wind. Do not mock spiritual experiences. That is a cursed disposition.  Remove Reply Quote Notify 1870  Forums / Theology Forum / Spiritual Experiences on: December 14, 2011, 08:23:35 AM I had an experience this morning. If followed three days of crying out to God in the Psalms. I was baptized with a confidence that i cannot describe. The mediation became so sweet that each word was rolling off of my lips like sweet honey. I was spoken to in a still quiet voice. There were angels that were around. There was no vision just this sweet confidence that He was answering my cries. I am going to write about my experiences . It was reveal to me this week a new supplement to take in a way that the former medicine was to be taken. I do not think i would have known how to take this new one without the practice of the other medicine. It gives me a lot of new feelings in my head. I am encouraged by it to pray more. Oh the sweet healer with me falling 12 feet on my back and getting up and walking away ... being healed... and then given more energy... God is good. These sweet experiences i long for... and this longing only draws me into more meditation. Reply Quote Notify 1871  Members Only / Purgatory / Re: The Art of War on: December 13, 2011, 06:12:59 PM Quote from: Kings_kid on December 13, 2011, 01:44:53 PM mbG:  "We accept that God is both a God of love.. promised in HIs covenant and a God of judgement enacted upon all the reprobate. To believe in any other power is to be double minded." K_k:  When we understand that God's Judgment is the perfect extension of His love, which is both His nature and His expressions of that nature, then we can know that the One Who has all power, also has all compassion and mercy in His capable Hands, even for the ultimately lost. And then we no longer need to curse anyone, but can bless them as He instructs, and leave the Judging to Him. Luke 6:28 "...bless those who curse you, and pray for those who spitefully use you." Romans 12:14 "Bless those who persecute you; bless and do not curse. " Those verses are in the context of the church life... we do not curse our brothers... to curse our brothers is to claim then need some other atonement than Christ alone. Or if we talk about the problem of sin outside of the context of the cross in reference to our brothers in Christ and spread this around then we are in essence cursing ourselves. Although it translates into being encircled by Gods protection. Over looking sin etc. Here is the principle. To think that the personal forgiveness of a person is not enough is to talk like a reprobate. But we know that we all do cursed things in this life. But since we are in Christ He has taken the curse away. So if we curse in the church its only those who do not really know Christ. Its also asking God to not lead us into temptation ... to deliver us from evil. So in the christian context cursing is for the christian community is actually calling on God to hem us in and not give us what we deserve in sin and in punishment. Its never in the context of judgement. This is why i try to stay mostly in meditation as a general principle because in my opinion its too dangerous to find other resolutions outside of the legitimate ones. Our mouths lead us into all kinds of idol worship.   Remove Reply Quote Notify 1872  Forums / Theology Forum / Re: Mind Renewal Through Transparency : The Psychology of Life on: December 13, 2011, 12:36:02 PM When ever these men claimed they have been faithful it is in the context of God working. In other words God works and men only see God work. Let me explain. If any system that man produces could be acceptable to God as that by which man proves his faithfulness then God is a Tyrant. Now listen this is terribly important. It is the difference between a fascist system and a free system of checks and balances. Because all freedom comes out of the fear of God! God must be said to work alone because all men compare themselves with other men. And in comparing themselves with other men they seek to excuse themselves of what they are responsible in comparison with other men. Now listen God sees men not as comparisons but with pity. lol So God must do the work in order for it to be declared good. Now then this brings men down. This destroys mens pride. Men naturally rule by threats and violence. They do not allow weakness to reign. Men lose their since of justice and equality in a normal human relationship. Men are the worse judges of other men. But God is to be feared. He is watching in this way. He prevents injury by His divine working. He allows men the ability to perform by His gift of grace. Gods job performance is to give the most room to fail... for men to get tired ... for men to lose a sense of worth by their job and for men to be rewarded beyond their ability. Gods ways are focused on the respect because wherever God works it is in light of the weakness of man. A free society is one who fears God enough to do every work unto God and not to man. Because in doing this they work on the basis that they treat others the way they would want to be treated. So God must overcome mens greed... their covetousness through His working. When men see this then there is more room for success.. more grace in real rewards and a real praise to God that not only is the work gifted to them but every thing they receive is a gift from God. But if men do not fear God they grow narrow and greedy and in doing this God destroys their way lest they destroy other men. God alone must be praised for His work. This is what we say to God about our faithfulness.   Remove Reply Quote Notify 1873  Forums / Theology Forum / Re: Mind Renewal Through Transparency : The Psychology of Life on: December 13, 2011, 11:59:57 AM Works are a by product of our faith and not from a faith that works by us. Faith is a gift and the working of faith is through grace. The baby that is born so to speak is works. So the life of grace is the focus of the birthing process as if we spent 9 months focusing on the glory of the experience and 3 hrs birthing the work. We are totally accepted so that we do not feel a connection to our works as if they made us more accepted. So our work is an overflow of our faith. We declare our work right not from the intrinsic effort we put in it but because He makes it good. So that we are drawn into a life of good works by how we experience the goodness of God. I am going to focus on this aspect of faith and works in light of free grace acceptance and not in the religious expectation of men.   Remove Reply Quote Notify 1874  Forums / Theology Forum / Re: The Psalms :John Calvin on: December 13, 2011, 11:42:04 AM 7. And I, in the multitude [or abundance] of thy mercy, will enter into thy house; I will worship in thy holy temple in thy fear. Some think that the word and, by which this sentence is joined to the preceding, is put for but; as if David, comparing himself with the ungodly, declared and assured himself that God would be merciful to him, while he abhorred and would destroy the wicked. But I leave it to my readers to judge whether it does not suit the passage better to consider this verse as an inference from what goes before, which might be put in this form: ”O Lord, thou canst not bear with the wicked; when, therefore, I am saved out of their hands by thy power, I will come to present myself before thee in thy temple, to give thee thanks for the deliverance which thou hast vouchsafed to me.” If the former interpretation be preferred, then the prophet, by simply commending his own piety towards God, separates himself from the class of whom he spoke. The scope of the passage leads us to understand him as promising to give thanks to God. He had before spoken of his enemies as hated of God; and now, being persuaded that God will keep him in safety, he calls himself to the exercise of gratitude. I will come into thy temples says he, in the multitude of thy mercy; as if he had said, I may now seem to be in a condition almost desperate, but by the favor of God, I shall be kept in perfect safety. This passage, therefore, teaches us, that when we are afflicted by the most distressing temptations, we ought to set the grace of God before our eyes, in order thereby to be supported with the hope of the divine interposition amidst the greatest dangers. Farther, as our carnal minds either wickedly undervalue the grace of God, or put the low estimate upon it which is commonly put by the world, let us learn to extol its wonderful greatness, which is sufficient to enable us to overcome all fears. The primary object of David was to encourage himself in the assured hope of preservation from the mercy of God; but at the same time he shows, that upon obtaining deliverance, he will be grateful to God for it, and keep it in remembrance. And as hypocrites, in giving thanks to God, do nothing else but profane his name, inasmuch as they themselves are unholy and polluted, he therefore resolves to come in the fear of God, in order to worship him with a sincere and upright heard. Again, we may hence draw the general truth, that it is only through the goodness of God that we have access to him; and that no man prays aright but he who, having experienced his grace, believes and is fully persuaded that he will be merciful to him. The fear of God is at the same time added, in order to distinguish genuine and godly trust from the vain confidence of the flesh. Remove Reply Quote Notify 1875  Forums / Theology Forum / Re: Discipleship and Two- Line Mysticism on: December 13, 2011, 10:28:05 AM Why does my generation think we can carry the world on our shoulders? There is a real forgetfulness and a self loathing that is just evil. There is nothing wrong with complaining that we are getting the shaft so to speak.. let me encourage you to be a little nicer to yourself. Get a little more angry and complain a little more. It will make people respect you not walk all over you! The christian man knows the history and feels and lives in the evils through the decline. He knows how his freedoms are being taken away from him. People dont destroy yourself because you are too proud to face this slavery. God is not impressed.