Psalm 60 1 You have rejected us, O God, and burst forth upon us; you have been angry-now restore us! 2 You have shaken the land and torn it open; mend its fractures, for it is quaking. 3 You have shown your people desperate times; you have given us wine that makes us stagger. 4 But for those who fear you, you have raised a banner to be unfurled against the bow. Selah This
is sort of a pause under the power of the Spirits work in the infusion
of assurance and confidence. The next plea is very strong by the actual
circumstances as opposed to this infusion of a reminder of His covenant
love. 5 Save us and help us with your right hand, that those you love may be delivered. 6 God has spoken from his sanctuary: "In triumph I will parcel out Shechem and measure off the Valley of Succoth. 7 Gilead is mine, and Manasseh is mine; Ephraim is my helmet, Judah my scepter. 8 Moab is my washbasin, upon Edom I toss my sandal; over Philistia I shout in triumph." 9 Who will bring me to the fortified city? Who will lead me to Edom? 10 Is it not you, O God, you who have rejected us and no longer go out with our armies? 11 Give us aid against the enemy, for the help of man is worthless. 12 With God we will gain the victory, and he will trample down our enemies. This is a synopsis of the ot narrative.
1 Man himself is powerless to produce a change in society.
2 Gods work in society is done with the view that He being the first cause personifies all second causes.
3 God hands the reprobate over to sin and addictions by His sovereign decree.
4 There is a distinct difference between the sheep and the wolves in Gods visible church.
5
God not only gets the glory in the end, but men are silenced before Him
in acknowledging His rite to do as He pleases on acknowledging the
powerlessness of men.
6 There is always in the statement of "his
people", the "recipients of His anger" a national voice but the plea is
by the remnant that marks the distinction of His acceptance. The remnant
are living in reality, the rest of the nation are living in a dream
because they are given over to the sins of the generation. 3 You have shown your people desperate times; you have given us wine that makes us stagger This is the righteous plea about the national addiction. 4 But for those who fear you, you have raised a banner to be unfurled against the bow. Selah Now look at this strong conjunction." But to those who fear you"
Now
on the one hand the national Israel are in a stupor of mindless
addiction to sin, possibly a metaphor in the phrase "us stagger" I mean
it could be drunkenness but it was more addiction as well. The banner
was placed in each home, as a declaration of whos name was represented
as opposed to the holding of idols. Our homes are supposed to be
sanctuaries of speaking His word out loud in meditation and prayer nite
and day with the longing encouraged by historically doctrinal music.
This is the freedom that is the banner in the NT. Basically is Gods name
that God upholds in His people.(Not perfect) Because look at what they
believe in their plea for the nation.6 God has spoken from his sanctuary: "In triumph I will parcel out Shechem and measure off the Valley of Succoth. 7 Gilead is mine, and Manasseh is mine; Ephraim is my helmet, Judah my scepter. 8 Moab is my washbasin, upon Edom I toss my sandal; over Philistia I shout in triumph." In
other words God has spoken in His special illumination in the worship
of His people. God is the mighty warrior who enacts His salvation for
His church who is powerless in the sense to find strength to save by
their own abilities. This is a personification of Gods sovereign rule of
the national boundaries of Israel.The remnant are calling on God to intervene for the nation in the plea of bringing salvation by His rite hand
And
then you have the acknowledgment that man is helpless to procure
ability in themselves. This Psalm as others ends with the culmination of
the plea being the highest part of the cries. In other words if one
were to use this meditation as his prayer, then he would find that his
own voice rising to this plea the "help of man is worthless!!"
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Forums / Theology Forum / Re: True Repentance
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on: August 04, 2009, 10:59:08 PM
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I
didnt listen to the whole speech but i am sensing that this is not
going in a knowledge direction but more of feeling the detestable part
of an addiction. I dont believe there are any short cuts. Its a
marathon. Its better to go to teaching first even if it doesnt seem to
work for awhile. The point i am trying to make is that the doctrine of
repentance is not suppose to tire someone out... its suppose to
encourage very slow growth and sometime there are struggles with
declining. There were two questions i had about his use of
scripture. One was the apostle John did not quote the verse if we say
that we have no sin we deceive ourselves before the verse if we confess
our sins he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins... but the order
was reversed in the text so that we did not think we could confess to
no sin. Another one was that we are never delivered completely from sin. Nor are we defined by that sin.
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4515
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Forums / Main Forum / Re: Questions
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on: August 03, 2009, 04:21:36 PM
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1 Samuel 16:13 So Samuel took the horn of oil
and anointed him in the presence of his brothers, and from that day on
the Spirit of the LORD came upon David in power. Samuel then went to Ramah. 1 Sam 30 6b "But David encouraged and strengthened himself in the Lord his God." In
Psalm 51 The prayer is about the strength of the Holy Spirit in Davids
being anointed as king. He had these times where there would be a very
profound experience... i think it was at the height of this power that
was a communication of the goodness and kindness of God. This is what
results.There were these times the Spirit of illumination would sorta
fall on him. 2 Samuel 9 1 David asked, "Is there anyone still left of the house of Saul to whom I can show kindness for Jonathan's sake?" I think this was one of those times. 2 Samuel 22 17 "He reached down from on high and took hold of me; he drew me out of deep waters.18 He rescued me from my powerful enemy, from my foes, who were too strong for me. 19 They confronted me in the day of my disaster, but the LORD was my support. 20 He brought me out into a spacious place; he rescued me because he delighted in me. Same
kind of anointing here... an overlap of personal experience and victory
in battle. The Holy Spirits power. This Psalm is repeated here...
possibly one of Davids favorites.
There was another one and i cant remember now. Heres something interesting. 2
Samuel 6 7 The LORD's anger burned against Uzzah because of his
irreverent act; therefore God struck him down and he died there beside
the ark of God. 8 Then David was angry because the LORD's wrath had broken out against Uzzah, and to this day that place is called Perez Uzzah. [e] 9 David was afraid of the LORD that day and said, "How can the ark of the LORD ever come to me?" 10 He was not willing to take the ark of the LORD to be with him in the City of David.This
is sorta a synopsis of Davids life. He goes from anger to fear and then
to blessing.I do not think this anger is reverence but its his
reaction. I have always looked at this as the holiness of God but look
at the reaction of the man after Gods own heart. Anger and fear are
closely related. Then he brings the ark into the city later where the
Spirit comes on him in this experience. 2 Samuel 6 14 David,
wearing a linen ephod, danced before the LORD with all his might, 15
while he and the entire house of Israel brought up the ark of the LORD
with shouts and the sound of trumpets. 16 As the ark of the LORD was
entering the City of David, Michal daughter of Saul watched from a
window. And when she saw King David leaping and dancing before the LORD,
she despised him in her heart. This
is interesting... she was barren because of this. But it was just a
short time ago that David was angry with God. Wow... God is sovereign
... He chooses to do as He ple
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Forums / Theology Forum / Re: Forgiveness
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on: August 03, 2009, 12:45:54 PM
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As you know i am going to explore another side
to our culture of man centered flattery. The reason that i want to do
this is because most people think that forgiveness is universal and in
making all kinds of stipulations of being inclusive the forgiveness ends
up being something that must be paid for in order to be forgiveness. I
really do not understand how people can be so defensive that it must be
about forgiving everyone and yet turn around and be defensive after
they claim that they have forgiven that person. Forgiveness is very hard
to understand. And it is the reason that all of our understanding of
God as Father as giving us His love in a way that we are assured that He
has loved us personally. Forgiveness is not mainly receiving
something from one another. Forgiveness involves having a proper
understanding of the spirit of flattery. This is why if forgiveness is
man centered then it will be a reflection of how the culture of that
society functions under the authority of man centered religion. The
Pharisees practiced forgiveness but it had all kinds of stipulations
about these trust issues. It was always more important to forgive the
closer one got to the top of the chain of command. In order to please or
move up the authority structure. This is not forgiveness this is
flattery. Forgiveness is focused on God and His communication to us of
His love. Forgiveness is learned when we see that we cannot earn it .
We get closer and closer to flattery the more we focus on man.
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4523
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Forums / Main Forum / Re: Gods call versus just an idea?
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on: July 31, 2009, 08:01:19 PM
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God moves us by working in our lives the
preparation in front of us. And i do not think that we can avoid this
working. This is why we cannot depend upon our view of what is rite as a
general principle to go by. I mean look at Heb. here. 11 32And what
more shall I say? I do not have time to tell about Gideon, Barak,
Samson, Jephthah, David, Samuel and the prophets, 33who through faith
conquered kingdoms, administered justice, and gained what was promised;
who shut the mouths of lions, 34quenched the fury of the flames, and
escaped the edge of the sword; whose weakness was turned to strength;
and who became powerful in battle and routed foreign armies
Now look at what God did in other peoples lives....
36Some
faced jeers and flogging, while still others were chained and put in
prison. 37They were stoned[f]; they were sawed in two; they were put to
death by the sword. They went about in sheepskins and goatskins,
destitute, persecuted and mistreated— 38the world was not worthy of
them. They wandered in deserts and mountains, and in caves and holes in
the ground.
One person was perceived as a hero an was a
conqueror over the trials of this life and the other person was under
extreme trials and looked as if it was not a great kind of faith. And
yet God proved His glory in both men.
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4525
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Forums / Theology Forum / Re: Forgiveness
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on: July 31, 2009, 02:46:24 PM
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The self is a reflection of those ideas
from the minds view as worthy of its own goodness. There is a religious
self reflection. This is all connected to how a man views the
healthiness of his life. In a sense we all want to find the true
understanding of being comfortable in our own skin. How we think of
ourselves is who we are in that skin. So that we have many reasons to
find a settle view of our own self image as being healthy. These reasons
may be from a perfectly legitimate exercise of self examination.Because
God has made us with the ability to reason. We have been given these
faculties in order to find this sense of self worth. We know that we
were born to find some kind of understanding of who we are both in who
we are to become in the future and a settled view of the incompleteness
we know of in our reasoning in the present. So that we are never
satisfied with this inner experience or the circumstances by which we
have come to measure our self identity. The problems that we
encounter in this rational gymnastics is on the one hand to find
security in our identity by a disciplined exercise of using our reason
and our faculties to procure a general state of a healthy outlook. God
has made us with this ability to work and reason this out about
ourselves. He has given us an imagination in order for us to have an
enjoyment of the world around us and the ability to incorporate mental
pictures in order for us to produce the happy self. We after all are
different from the animals because we can have a rational self
reflection. But may i say that there is no way that we can find
forgiveness by this process. The problem with the human psyche is
that there are things that are impossible to find within man and his
ability to reason these things out by his natural gifts. The
impossibility comes because there is no presence of the spirit of
forgiveness in his abilities to reason as he was born. Man must look
outside the normal experience to find forgiveness. Because forgiveness
is caused by powers outside himself and they cannot effect the soul
unless they are from that origin. The center of all of the troubles in
this world as they relate to the view of ones self are from this motif
of Gods love. In this sense we are not seeking to work our forgiveness
by our own ability to reason, but we are trusting in someone who we
cannot know by our natural a
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Forums / Theology Forum / Re: Romans and the Flesh Monster.
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on: July 31, 2009, 02:29:21 AM
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We live in a day and age where the spirit
world has a less profound influence on the minds of people because of
the rapid discovery's of science. This makes it a very different way of
seeing things as they appear to the human eye but have no lasting
influence in bringing an aliveness to the spirit of a man. Man has a
real problem with trusting in his ability to reason things out as the
basis for his confidence in living in this world. And yet if we look
beyond the micro scope we will see that there is a more profound work
being done in the world of the unseen. This is why the divine influence
as a matter of personal experience draws out of the soul of man the deep
reality in finding his rest in God. The divine authority is this
revelation of power falling on a man rather than the accumulation of
experiences in understanding these spiritual paradigms. This is the Holy
Spirits work of power. He comes upon a man for the purpose of
enlightening his mind, filling him with power to speak, and teaching him
to know how deep and wide is the love of the Father.
We live in
the power and presence of these spiritual beings for the purpose of
being transformed in being shielded from the satanic designs of this
world. The angels are ministering spirits sent to serve those who will
inherit salvation. This is the experience of being revived with a
personal assurance of our Fathers love. The Holy Spirit comes down out
of heaven and rest on Jesus head as a dove. He comes upon Jesus in the
beginning of His earthly ministry and Jesus the man is filled with power
from on high. Then Jesus is sent out into the desert to be tempted by
the devil and His immediate response is to speak the word of God with
boldness. Christ needed the Holy Spirit to fill Him with power from on
high.
Then you have the disciples in the upper room having a
prayer meeting. They had been told by our Lord that they should tarry in
Jerusalem because Christ was going to send the Holy Spirit to baptize
them with power for witness. So they are led to pray. Because in order
fora man to be filled with the Holy Spirit he must be thrown into a
desperate condition. Just like the apostle Paul who said that he was
buffeted on every side and he had even given up all hope in this world.
Men are led to pray, plead, cry, weep, and long for the baptism of the
Spirit of fire!!
Now then the Spirit came down on the day of
Pentecost and they were so filled that they began to speak in other
languages, unknown tongs and they all were as if they were drunk. They
were filled with joy and they began to speak the word of God with
boldness!! These people did not have a worked up kind of emotional
experience but they were actually filled with the revelation of what
salvation brings to the understanding of a man. As the apostle prayed
the the eyes of our hearts would be enlightened and we would have an
understanding of this mystery of Gods salvation in Christ. These people
were filled with a sense of the presence of Christ , and His
resurrection power. It wasnt because they had a deep knowledge of
scripture but it was an miraculous event, a full revelation of the joy
of the Holy Ghost!!
The apostle says later on that he was driven from
one place to another on his missionary journeys by the Holy Spirit. It
was an experience that he had a sense of the grace of God filling him
with this drive.
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4532
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Forums / Theology Forum / Re: Of Course I Want to Sin...
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on: July 30, 2009, 07:21:28 PM
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... badly, sometimes. I also want to not
sin badly as well. Do I sometimes fear that I may be sinning that grace
may abound? Sometimes I do. Am I? All I can say is, I don't ever consciously recall embarking on any
sin with that in mind. So who'll save me from this Mexican standoff
between my unregenrate flesh and my regenerate spirit? Hint: End of
Romans 7. So, let's have at it, how do all you deal with wanting to sin? (And simultaneously not wantint to?). Oh, by the way...Scripture fight!  Well
as always TB this is a very good question. First i think that sin can
destroy us. Sometimes a very mature believer can be in such a struggle
that the last memory of that person is being burdened beyond the ability
to be comforted and they pass on to the other side under the sorrow
that absolutely killed them. We can loose the battle with sin in our
final days. This is why i do not think that we are guaranteed a smooth
plateau at anytime in our lives. This is why the christian life
is a marathon, because there are so many potential circumstances that
can bring enough trouble with sin that we are overcome in being under
the trial. We are very short sighted with making connections when we are
looking for reasons to draw parallels to our present struggles. In some
ways we are waiting for these trials to become so difficult that we
feel we cant go on. I think Job says that what he feared had become his
experience. In reality there are very few people who live in the house
of mourning.I think Solomon says that this is the blessed place. So that
in this trial we are being tempted to depart but we know that we cannot
depart because He is holding onto us and yet we have but a flickering
light left to hold onto. Our sins are more than the hairs of our
heads!!! This is why that a very mature christian can fall under
the power of sin and temptation to long to be taken from this world. Now
even tho we play this potential to danger over and over in our own
minds as a pattern that has never really been erased in our
dispositions, we still do it knowing that we have been worthy of fleeing
because of our own guilt. This potential is what defines us as being
human. Christ never departed once from His Fathers will... although He
wanted to go another way than the cross if it was at all possible. And
you see this sorrow as a part of His very being while He was growing in
His obedience. He being God knew intimately what the future would hold
... the awful suffering. And yet He walked that road with perfect trust.
He was a man who offered up petitions and prays with loud cries and
tears to the one who could save Him from death. If Christ would be
tempted to flee... what do you think the potential is in us? There have
been many saints that have lost in the struggle in the last mile and are
rejoicing in heaven now!!!! Looking at our humanity as people
who are prone to wander i would say that this is so intricately
interwoven in our resisting sin that we are blind to how much we desire
to flee.
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4537
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Members Only / Purgatory / Re: Done with Self Pity
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on: July 29, 2009, 12:30:25 PM
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kylee... you have the exact experience we all
have... we always are here to give you grace.... you can be sure this
place is a haven for real sinners. Thanks... never thought any different
about you.
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Forums / Theology Forum / Re: Forgiveness
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on: July 29, 2009, 10:01:26 AM
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This is like the rich man whos only reason for
coming to God was out of self righteousness. You notice what Cain did
just after he had been told to try a little harder. You notice that God
did not say this to Abel. In fact God only reminded Israel about the
terms of the covenant because there were people who were part of the OT
church who were holding Idols... i mean ... not as a matter of falling
into temptation... but in the self righteous way. The natural reaction
for a believer when he hears the terms of the covenant are like David
proclaimed here.
Ps. 25 10 All the ways of the LORD are loving and faithful
for those who keep the demands of his covenant.
11 For the sake of your name, O LORD,
forgive my iniquity, though it is great.
Here
David hears the law and then his reaction is I am undone. And then his
desire is not a self righteous attitude that he will try a little
harder... no .. may it never be... it was that David could not even deal
with the sin or get forgiveness by his own effort. For the sake of your
name!!! Here is the context.
Psalm 13O 7 O Israel, put your hope in the LORD,
for with the LORD is unfailing love
and with him is full redemption.
8 He himself will redeem Israel
from all their sins.
Full
redemption...the price was fully paid by Christ... its His forgiveness
to give with no requirement on our part. In acknowledging His rite we
are living a life of repentance.(He himself.} That is hoping in His
unfailing love. Not only do we acknowledge that we have done wrong but
we acknowledge that we cant atone for it. Grace is living with the
reality that the name of the Lord is His method of perseverance for us.
It is He is persevering in us. God is pursuing us with forgiveness for
His own name sake even tho our name is the guilty party.
If we
can develop this attitude then we will teach our consciences the
necessary ways of God that not only give us confidence but these ways
keep us from being tempted to find our comfort in mans religion.
A
lot of people think that the law-grace message is the same for all the
church.... but i do not think the scripture presents this as a matter of
building confidence in his sheep. The matter of confidence is taught by
what God does for His own in being taught to not look to the law..
thats why the terms are always pointed at the reprobate. And the
reminder that Gods forgiveness is by the covenant of grace is always
toward the remnant. You always draw the line and then create a
separation in speaking to the deep need in the believers reaction to
that sorrow. This is getting into the mind of the believer. I am sorrow
that i need to do this but this is Calvinism at its best!!! We havent
even touched the surface here...in this day of Play genism.... this is
bringing down the walls.
Here i must say that wicked men are
always trying to soften the lines of forgiveness. This is so very
exclusive.... i would say that it is the jewel of Gods elect. For we
know His passionate heart by His design to forgive the worse offenses.
Its not that God has a general level of forgiveness... thats having our
eyes fixed on mans responses to God... because men are looking at the
shadows . Men like to be under the illusion that God is like them in His
requiring to meet the level of resistance to temptation that is
required in order for the so called elitist to be satisfied with the
proper sorrow in order to meet the requirements of their authority!!!
But God separates Himself by the religion of men and He speaks in His
own names authority in order to provide the sinner with a confidence as a
personal peace ...
God actually defines His forgiveness as
exclusive and definite.!!! He defines forgiveness as His to give!!! He
says you must look up to my ability in order to see that i require
nothing for you to gain my acceptance!!!! Not only is forgiveness not
found at the local soup kitchen but it is beyond anything that we can
find on this earth!!! Look at the expanse of the heavens... they go on
and on and on.... God is in heaven... and His work of redemption is
through all generations. Men are like grass... they grow for a very
short time and then they die... but God is from all eternity!!! Gods
name is above every name... He forgives us in His eternal love!!!! When
we learn of Gods forgiveness we find it to be a well spring of eternal
power to bring about the state of peace in our hearts apart from any
thing we believe about our acceptance as an ability to find forgiveness
by our own view of what God is like!!! God forgives in spite of our lack
of understanding of His free grace to work!!!This mystery is the glory
of trusting in Him alone to meet the requirements of the law in order
for Him to bring us to a confidence that we could not find in our best
efforts to find forgiveness!!!! Its for His name sake and for His alone
to provide for His own... we rejoice in this!!
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| 4542
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Forums / Theology Forum / Re: Was Christ "fully" human?
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on: July 29, 2009, 09:52:30 AM
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Thor
Some can do evil:
Abel did good in his offering to God and Cain did evil
God warns Cain before he committed murder:
Gen
4:7 If you do well, is there not exaltation? And if you do not do
well, sin is crouching at the door; and its desire is toward you; but
you should rule over it.
This is like the rich man whos only
reason for coming to God was out of self righteousness. You notice what
Cain did just after he had been told to try a little harder. You notice
that God did not say this to Abel. In fact God only reminded Israel
about the terms of the covenant because there were people who were part
of the OT church who were holding Idols... i mean ... not as a matter of
falling into temptation... but in the self righteous way. The natural
reaction for a believer when he hears the terms of the covenant are like
David proclaimed here. Ps. 25 10 All the ways of the LORD are loving
and faithful for those who keep the demands of his covenant. 11 For the sake of your name, O LORD, forgive my iniquity, though it is great. Here
David hears the law and then his reaction is I am undone. And then his
desire is not a self righteous attitude that he will try a little
harder... no .. may it never be... it was that David could not even deal
with the sin or get forgiveness by his own effort. For the sake of your
name!!! Here is the context.Psalm 13O 7 O Israel, put your hope in the
LORD, for with the LORD is unfailing love and with him is full redemption. 8 He himself will redeem Israel from all their sins. Full
redemption...the price was fully paid by Christ... its His forgiveness
to give with no requirement on our part. In acknowledging His rite we
are living a life of repentance.(He himself.} That is hoping in His
unfailing love. Not only do we acknowledge that we have done wrong but
we acknowledge that we cant atone for it. Grace is living with the
reality that the name of the Lord is His method of perseverance for us.
It is He is persevering in us. God is pursuing us with forgiveness for
His own name sake even tho our name is the guilty party. |
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4543
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Forums / Theology Forum / Re: Forgiveness
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on: July 29, 2009, 09:22:45 AM
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Forgiveness...
This is excellent ... we got to unpack this.
Forgiveness
flounders because I exclude the enemy from the community of humans even
as I exclude myself from the community of sinners. But no one can be in
the presence of the God of the crucified Messiah for long without
overcoming this double exclusion - without transposing the enemy from
the sphere of monstrous inhumanity into the sphere of shared humanity
and herself from the sphere of proud innocence into the sphere of common
sinfulness. When one knows that the torturer will not eternally triumph
over the victim, one is free to rediscover that person's humanity and
imitate God's love for him. And when one knows that God's love is
greater than all sin, one is free to see oneself in the light of God's
justice and so rediscover one's own sinfulness.
Miroslav Volf
Forgiveness
does not mean ignoring what has been done or putting a false label on
an evil act. It means, rather, that the evil act no longer remains as a
barrier to the relationship.
Martin Luther King Jr.
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