10160 Forums / Theology Forum / Atonement on: April 22, 2005, 06:15:40 AM When i talk to a person about Christ i stay on message because i want them to understand that the core issues are vital. I am offensive when i talk about sin and hell and i see a reaction in there apperance. I cannot just deal with people on an intellectual level. I think that there needs to be a reality check. I spend time praying for the people in my world. I realize how hard it is to believe. I also know that God is the one who saves people inspite of my sins. I think the reasoning about the\" house on fire \"is relevent today. I think the unsaved will see what is important to you as they get to know you. But there is a reality that no matter how many arguments you have the issue is the heart. No man can change the heart. I had an experience where a friend who was unsaved was suddenly taken ill and through talking about my faith and his past religious experience he came to the Lord before he died. I could have begged till i was blue in the face and never changed his heart. I think prayer is vital in gospel presentation because we are fighting in the spiritual realm. 10169 Forums / Main Forum / Secret Place Of The Most High on: April 20, 2005, 07:57:38 PM \"The fowlers snare\" Have you ever been afraid that the evil perpretrated from some one else might fall on you? The situation could be from your weakness that is magnified by the evils of other people and you feel that it is unfair. Not everything that is experience by us that is negative come from our sin. Many times we are caught in the web of the world system and those sins the world forces us to deal with. This age in which we live is a very evil age. Just try to drive on the roads and not be confronted with an angry driver. There are even more schemes that the average family is confronted with in raising children and in owning things. We must admit that not only are we fighting inside battles but we are confronting outside pressures and fleeting freedoms as sin increases around us. So this psalm speaks to me in a bigger than life kind of way. Snares are all over the place and my Father is always keeping me from getting entangled in them. That is the refuge that His children enjoy. If i get my foot caught in a snare He comes to my rescue and turns my situation for His glory. Can we feel safety admist such opposition? With a Father who cares about the evils His children are confronted with we certianly can! Oh what love that is experienced. When you pray for Him to save you from the snare in your life and He gives you a life lesson on what you prayed for. Take a hold of that confidence and glory in Him. That is a faith builder and your confidence in Him will be so great that people around you will take notice. Really, you will be brought out of yourself and into raptures of the Fathers safe place that you can retreat to in prayer. 10172 Forums / Theology Forum / Atonement on: April 20, 2005, 06:05:47 PM My problem with presenting the gospel is the sark reality that it condemns the wicked and accuses them of hating God. So i have been guilty in the past of not explaining it in negative terms at all and really presenting a false gospel. Sin is not just a side issue that comes at the end of the presentation. Nor is it a hidden thread in the love of Jesus for the world. Rather sin is the main issue and the law is the focus in bringing people to understand who God is and what relationship they are to Him so that they see their need. You look in the gospels and what kind of heart that is given grace. It is always the absolutely desperate individual who has no hope in this life. This reality is the ground for salvation and the state in which the saint enjoys grace. To present this to the american mind who has everything they need and who are set in their frame of the postmodern state really brings on persecution. Most people want a gospel that has no bite to it[ no conviction] They want the gospel to be like the car they drive with all the bells and whistles and very little irritation. Really when we are those who are humbled and brought low that is the reality that is against the fast pace get all you can thinking . So you are left to be alone so much in this american culture and your message is rejected and your church is accused of being too negative. I love reading the prophets who spoke the word to people who were averse to everything they said. They were all alone so much of the time in an unhappy state. Go to Jeremiah and read this book. Think about what God put him through to get the message rite. ReplyReply Reply with quoteQuote Notify of repliesNotify 10173 Forums / Theology Forum / Atonement on: April 20, 2005, 09:47:04 AM The question is what is the main purpose of the christian life? Is it to reach the world by making the truth acceptable? We do need to be witnesses in the world and loving the world. But again there are these misaprehensions of what the christian gospel is about and the nature of the scriptures importance in church's daily life. Which goes back to the pts i made about the postmoderns ability to apprehend these truths. 2 generations of american educated have a settled in idolatry of middle eastern mysticism with protestantism. IE. The hollywood culture . Our main purpose in life is to glorify God and enjoy Him forever. 10181 Forums / Break Room / So, How Do Yew Meditate? on: April 19, 2005, 06:17:57 AM Some times life can be so diffcult that we are left to cry out in pain. Our bodies react to those inward pains and we grope around feeling lost and our crys are from absolute helplessness. There is no more human trust left but a feeble cry. Yet we are also left with this thought that we take the good times for granted and we some times do spite to His goodness. So the bad times are their to teach us to appreciate Him when He blesses us. Have you gotten to the pt where you are skin and bone and you have no one to talk to? Are you in such pain that it controls every area of you life including eating? Are you without a home, put out on the streets? Things could be worse! The important thing is to slow down and think of those things that are bugging you and then think of how big God is. Think a lot about His control. There is nothing in my life that He has not designed. He is hurting me for a purpose. Don't try to concur the world but just give yourself a lot of down time. Rest and tell yourself that God is soveriegn and He is going to work these things out. Take it moment by moment. Pray a lot even though it hurts. He may seem far away and silent because He is building your faith [trusting in the unseen]. Just tell Him how you feel in complete honesty. ReplyReply Reply with quoteQuote Notify of repliesNotify 10182 Forums / Main Forum / Secret Place Of The Most High on: April 19, 2005, 05:44:07 AM This is an interesting Psalm because it is sort of a metaphorical look at the safe place in this world. I picture the Psalmist sitting under a tree looking at the flock of birds flying around. He is thinking about all the dangers that birds are faced with. He gives a vivid picture about a massive desease that hits the bird population and he compares this to the day of judgment when we will be there and watch the wicked go off into eternal punishment. We will be safe in the hands of the Lord. A striking meditation, but a real confidence builder for those who have their faith in the Most High. \"It will not come near you\" that is the judgement into eternal destruction. \"The punishment of the wicked\" . The bird that is used for safety is the eagle and the safe place is under his wings. That is our relationship with our Heavenly Father. That is where we cry out to the Most High and He hears us because we are the people who are poor and needy. He is our only source of protection in this world and we are helpless. We are just like the birds flying around exposed to the dangers of this fallen world. Our trust is not in the power of kings but in the Most High. He will judge and make things right in the end even though we go through this short time of testing and danger. 10185 Forums / Theology Forum / "god Doesn't Care About Our Happiness" on: April 18, 2005, 11:12:57 PM My experience has been that when i have gone through depression or real tough trials that i have spent alot of time meditating, looking at the problem,and praying. When i have had relief and looked back on those times they seem to be the closest times i have spent with the Lord in heaven on earth. Yet when i was going through them the pain that was driving me to that closeness seemed more than i could handle. I probably needed a close friend but that was what was dealt to me at the time. 10186 Forums / Theology Forum / "god Doesn't Care About Our Happiness" on: April 18, 2005, 11:05:41 PM I think we need to be patient and praying when we go through tough times. There is nothing wrong with asking God some serious questions about His percieved silence. We need to open our hearts in His presence even though we may come out of prayer feeling worse than we started in prayer. There are states of depression that are not easy to deal with. But we still need to get to the bottom of the problem and role it over to the Lord. I have been very angry when i have prayed and expressed that to the Lord. Prayer that is honest is going to bring healing and release of the burden. Come to Him with a complaint that is directed toward your wanting to trust Him but are experiencing the opposite and this is too much for you to handle. How long will He put you through this? When will He come to your relief? These are questions of mourners who have an interest in glorifying God. Plead the promises! James says \"Are you suffering,then pray!\" 10191 Forums / Break Room / So, How Do Yew Meditate? on: April 16, 2005, 04:40:06 AM Once again i come running to my Heavenly Father wanting to get unburden of the load and care. Why is this such a birthing of pain to leave my very loves and heart idols that are pushing out the joys of my loving Him for these temporary loves. Such struggles are like gravity pulling me down from His peace that exist in eternity that swollows up the tension i feel. I can have Christ alone or not at all and in having Him i feel the joy beyond any constraint of human intentions of what full joy embodys. Here is the earthly existence i long for; a grip of His gracious arms reaching down from eternity to hold down that those dreadful constraints that are nipping at my feet so that my faith though tried will find Him to be more than my all in all. Oh what a precious Saviour, the God of all Glory, the lover of my soul,that i may pour out those spices in my cup and share in His suffering and so fellowship with Him. 10207 Forums / Main Forum / I Am A Big Wuss! on: April 13, 2005, 06:56:09 AM im not trying to brag but i am good looking yet i had periods in my single life where i couldnt make a connection with a dog. I mean that is the way things were and i had to accept that as it was. When i just made a point to not think in that way the \"what if\" syndrom and spent time in social settings and church functions just enjoying myself then learning to be free in that way i met someone who i connected with as if i had known her in another life. It is what God is doing in your life that is more important than what you want. \"What if \"is a confidence killer and will hang over your head like a dead weight.Im glad your honest and it is a real battle to over come. Think about the way you think and then when you get into the rut put your thoughts on things above and learn to draw your comfort from those things. The test is when you are by yourself to get in a state where you are not pining away but your thoughts are all leading to optimistic things and enjoy those alone times. If you can then you will be better able to connect when God brings her along. I used to think when i was single that God was preparing my wife for me and i just hadnt met her yet. Look for friends that are the innocent people not real fast track kind. Church is real important . Calvinistic conservative girls are the best10225 Forums / Theology Forum / Oh, How I Love....dotrine? on: April 10, 2005, 11:29:31 AM I agree that the Gospel is the center of our affection but it is not only for the unsaved. The gospel is the means for the \"saving\" of our souls that is ongoing and the bigness of God is the central theme in this preached message. His grace ,that is the Fathers particular love for His own in sending His Son [who is co-equal with the Father and the Spirit ] He humble Himself and came as close to sin as He possibly could without sinning, lived a righteous life as a man yet fully God, died the death as man for sin He hates and yet hung on the cross as God, [the Glory of God ]rent the curtian in two, and rose from the dead conquring sin and death and rendering the Devil powerless, all this He did as The High Preist accomplishing the Fathers will, and securing salvation for those the Father gave Him before the foundation of the world, and now He is our advocate to be our only means for access into the Throne of God, and the reason we are loved by the Father with that love that He loved the Son because we have His righteousness. We live in this reality, a sure foundation, what a big God! Do you think of the gospel in this way, this is the reality that all principles of moral agents live in. There are only two realms we live in the realm of eternal life ,or the realm of this earth and its pleasures ending in eternal death in hell. Embrace Christ today by repenting of your own way and making Him your only Hope. 10233 Forums / Politics Forum / Form Of Government? on: April 10, 2005, 05:44:09 AM Our nation was set up as a republic, with a Presbyterian form of accountability. The gov. officials covenanted by placing their hand on the Bible that they would uphold the laws and guard the gospel. These presbys. were confederates or groups of spiritual leaders who counseled these government officials on how to better lead the people and hold them accountable in the moral leadership and constitutional responsibilities. We have moved far from this original republic to a democracy and the rise of the individualism which leaves people powerless to effect any change because the original structure for change was Presbyterian [group] and covenant accountability. We have moved those presby accountability to business accountability and the courts have changed the laws so that they are democratic in nature [the desire of the majority to effect change and this belief that the constitution is subject to change. What do you think? ReplyReply Reply with quoteQuote Notify of repliesNotify 10234 Forums / Prayer Requests / Sick on: April 10, 2005, 05:10:43 AM I am a vitamim freak and have been using the zinc lozengers. Still feel sick but getting better . This virus is a little diff from the common cold because there is also stomach nausea. Thanks for praying.God bless you all. Remove messageRemove ReplyReply Reply with quoteQuote Notify of repliesNotify 10235 Forums / Current Events / Form Of Government? on: April 10, 2005, 05:04:02 AM Our nation was set up as a republic, with a Presbyterian form of accountability. The gov. officials covenanted by placing their hand on the Bible that they would uphold the laws and guard the gospel. These presbys. were confederates or groups of spiritual leaders who counseled these government officials on how to better lead the people and hold them accountable in the moral leadership and constitutional responsibilities. We have moved far from this original republic to a democracy and the rise of the individualism which leaves people powerless to effect any change because the original structure for change was Presbyterian [group] and covenant accountability. We have moved those presby accountability to business accountability and the courts have changed the laws so that they are democratic in nature [the desire of the majority to effect change and this belief that the constitution is subject to change. What do you think? 10242 Forums / Main Forum / Wicked Is My Righteousness Yes? on: April 09, 2005, 10:02:02 PM Motivation is a hard nut to crack. Should we stop reading the Bible and praying because we think we are doing it for the selfish reasons only? I say May it never be! There is a reason for wanting forgiveness that is bad. We could be focusing on our feelings and the trouble our sin has brought us and that is the wrong motivation. That usually does not lead to healing and change. The psalmist would say\" search me Oh God and know my heart.\" We really need the grace to repent and have genuine sorrow over sin. This is not really a burdensome legal exercise but an understanding of who God is and how our sin has offended Him and His graciousness in forgiving us. It centers on the greatness of God! The problem with selfish motivation is that we dont know how great God is. When we focus Him on His soveriengty, then we understand our problem and our motivations will change. Its really that simple. 10252 Forums / Theology Forum / What Is Real Freedom? on: April 09, 2005, 01:22:19 PM wbennet- I agree with you and would only add one thing. There is a historical context in all of this theology that we should not be unlearned in. These positions have been tested through the ages and really the central elements of understanding these evangelical position has been the dissagreements over worship and the message of the gospel. Historical protestant worship has had its low time and its high times. Worship in the church was its thermometer. Those members were not concerned mainly for unity at any expence but concerned about what true biblical churchmanship looked like. That included dissagreements and much pain to get to those high points. Where we are today in our evolution is a the low end of the thermomater. What looks like unity may be a desire for acceptance. Remove messageRemove ReplyReply Reply with quoteQuote Notify of repliesNotify 10253 Forums / Theology Forum / What Is Real Freedom? on: April 09, 2005, 01:05:47 PM UB- Thanks i will take that to heart. I agree with you but i am finding on this forum that we have a lot of teachers and very few people who clean the church. I will agree that these people have a love that has action. But all of us are gifted differently and if i were not exersizing my gifts then i would be miserable. The gospel is the most simple truth on the face of the earth. Humanly people stumble over its simplicity. Yet it is very complicated and requires a lot of study and application. Everyone has a responsiblity to apply themselves to study these truths. 1 Tim. 3:16 Yet some people are better equipped than others. We have been made in such a way that we are always wanting more of the Spirit. We are experience craven sinners who would dry up if the gospel was not our consuming passion. There are those who have such a wonderful devotion to Christ with little ability and few words but when they speak they have experienced those things. And there are people who are so intellectual that they use many words and have little to show in experience. So we should be patient with one another to work these things out. There are the John the baptist types who are more interested in seperation than getting dirty. Jesus spent more time with the sinners because they needed Him in their desperation. So all of us are very different and should seek to use our gifts even though we suffer for Him. 10258 Forums / Theology Forum / Psalms 119 A Supernatural Experience Of Grace? on: April 09, 2005, 11:21:51 AM There will always be imperfection or bias both in the distribution of the truth drawn from the text and in the reception of that said truth. Man is totally depraved and twist these things based apoun his sin both known and unknown. We see through a glass dimmly so these heavenly things are filled with mystery. Yet we have been given God the Holy Spirit and we have truth that can be understood for salvation.The requirements are for us to submit to Christ and in doing this we submit to all His words, the whole counsel of God. 10260 Forums / Theology Forum / What Is Real Freedom? on: April 09, 2005, 10:59:14 AM If you just sit home and read your Bible ,are you being obedient? He has ordained preaching as the means for learning. There are truths that are drawn from the words of scripture that are formulated into doctrines which are the essence of biblical revelation.It is those very doctrines applied to the souls life experiences that are the answers to the intangled thoughts that drive its desires. The sense of scripture is drawn from the truths brought out in preaching which is the essence of the Divine illumination. Read those good books! Let the exegetical interpretation be your all consuming passion in bringing your thoughts captive to the Word of God. 10276 Forums / Theology Forum / What Is Real Freedom? on: April 08, 2005, 06:31:16 PM i love the doctrine and i like discusssing it. Im sorry about your brother and i hope that he returns to the faith. i know there are a lot of reasons why we struggle in our christian experience. Doctrine is very important and my motives are not what you think. I believe that the bible is not enough to understand who God is and what His requirements are. As you know the bible has ordained preaching as the instrument for learning and growing in the faith so these books are old sermons of dead theologians who were called by God to expound His word. I know that you go to church and here someone else teach you so i dont think i am in this alone. 10289 Forums / Theology Forum / Psalms 119 A Supernatural Experience Of Grace? on: April 08, 2005, 01:35:53 PM I am really having a hard time understanding this reasoning. I know that the bible can be understood by any one but just like work the more you put into something the more you will get out of something. In comparision to your work i have never met a person who talks about his job like you talk about study of scriptures. I dont mean to sound condmeming but how many people say about there job that you really dont need to understand the specifics just the in general things. It seems to me that when your apply yourself to something you love that thing no matter what others think. I just think your argument is a sort of law of non-contradiction. You cannot not love theology and understand it at the same time. 10291 Forums / Theology Forum / Oh, How I Love....dotrine? on: April 08, 2005, 01:18:53 PM Yes to a certian extent this is true. But we can dissagree and be adults about it. The danger on the other side of this argument is that we dont get into scripture and we remain babys only on the milk of the word and we need to go on. If you dont gaurd your doctrine then you will create a vacum for all kinds of philosophys to thrive. We are either going forward or going backwards there is no stagnation that exist in the christian world. Wen you stand for something you will have people take sides if this is not your experience ,chances are you are not growing in the Lord. 10299 Forums / Theology Forum / What Is Real Freedom? on: April 08, 2005, 05:06:29 AM Guys the way we think of God is how we will think of ourselves. If we really want to experience true freedom then we need to acknowlege that God is truely free to chose whomever He wants when He wants. Man , when i get this vision in the preaching of Calvinism i am drawn out of myself. This is the most freeing experience i will ever have on this earth. If i have one ounce of human effort mixed in this i will limit God and thus not be really free in my christian life. If you are under great trials and you are really struggling trusting God and you are really not convinced that He is absolutely soveriegn try this way of thinking I promise you that you will experience true freedom. What do you think? 10354 Forums / Theology Forum / Psalms 119 A Supernatural Experience Of Grace? on: April 04, 2005, 10:14:08 PM I think we need to start emphasising the reasons we have a bible and that is because we have had isolated saints who wrote letters to the churches. Their whole passion was to get the gospel rite no matter if they stood alone apart from the group. Christ says you cant serve 2 masters you must hate the other and love Him. Men have died at the stake standing alone on the Word OF God and against much opposition.Look at martin luther he stood against the world when he saw justification by faith. Can you imagine what was said about him? All the imperfections that he suffered and the depression? Yet he changed the world by Gods grace. We must make scripture the central appoligitic of all of lifes issues and compare all other doctrines to the light of the word . If we dont then we will be the practical higher critisist as in practical atheist. 10361 Forums / Theology Forum / Psalms 119 A Supernatural Experience Of Grace? on: April 04, 2005, 06:20:59 AM Quote HE is the object of faith. The law is the Christ to come. It has taken me some time to see this. Because when you think about it, speaking the way he does about a law seems silly. Their relationship to the law in the OT was much more burdensom than ours becaues of all the ceramonial and dietary laws. It was the covenant that God made with Abraham that was a salvific covenant, a grace covenant. It had requirements to obey God and keep the law. But they could not keep the law so they had the sacrifices to be the atonement for their breaking the law. Granted the old system was burdensome but it gave them the same kind of faith that we enjoy. There were a lot of shadows in the revelation of God. But Gods grace was greater and they had a deep faith. The law was there to show them their need for a future Savior so they were looking forward to the promised Redeemer. The new covanent is much better because all the law is fulfilled in Christ. He kept the law completely and He is the Word of God, the revelation of God in time. He is the logic of all truth in that the cross represents the reality in which we live on a daily basis. He is the Truth. The old system with the sacrifices from day to day were a temperary means to deal with sin but could not forgive sin, only the death of Christ could take away sin. The law now has the same relation to us but minus the ceromonial and dietary because they are obosolete. We have an obligation to keep the law and it is a real obligation not just to show us how short we fall. We never keep the law but we have a tension of trying to and falling short. Christ atonement satisfied for our sin and the law leads us to Christ. We never keep the law because we are totally depraved and all our works are tainted with sin wrong motives etc. We have Christ righteousness put to our account and we have access to God through Christ. In Christ we are accepted by the Father as righteous. Praise God. We are no longer under condemnation. 10376 Forums / Theology Forum / Psalms 119 A Supernatural Experience Of Grace? on: April 03, 2005, 12:41:50 AM These are tough issues here. We must not think of the word as written per say but a spoken word. They are the very words of God. These words give eternal life by the Spirit. The creation of man was by the spoken word of God. These words are of a supernatural kind. The word is the means by which we understand who God is and what He requires. Or if you want to know God you know Him by His word. Jesus Christ is the revelation of God. When we think of who God is in order to have a God that is not of our own making we must accept that revelation. He came in the flesh and died in our place. If we only see God as a spirit and disperses Himself in peices to people that is how He reveals Himself then we have an idol. He was sent by the Father and accomplished the Fathers will. To believe in Christ we must believe what He says and that of every word. Submitting to Christ is submitting to His word. The bible does have all we need for life and godliness. I think thats in Corinthians. 10378 Forums / Main Forum / Do We Need To Be Reverent? on: April 03, 2005, 12:14:17 AM I think we miss out on a lot of relationships because we judge the outward things. Most people have good hearts in friendships.There is grace in the whole world and the unsaved are better at being transparent than christians are. To think that we are just in their lives to witness is short sited in my book. Friendships are developed over time and people can share things in common saved or unsaved. Just because they get drunk dosent mean that they are all bad. I have been shamed by them in being selfish and uncaring. There are unsaved that i could never be good as them in certian areas. God will do the saving and we must be ourselves worts and all. The main thing is to do good to everyone. ReplyReply Reply with quoteQuote Notify of repliesNotify 10379 Forums / Main Forum / Born Of The Spirit? on: April 02, 2005, 11:44:40 PM russgorsline, I come from a background where you sit and listen to the teaching and you keep quiet. You can miss apply this passage by ignoring other passages where it says to exhort one another and many other passages about our speech. I think that the question and answer setting is essential in the growth of believers and is needed as well as the preaching. I think the context in thess. is about not making a living and being in other peoples business by not being busy enough in our own lives. Hey, why do we come here but to communicate the love and grace of God. I dont think that is an absolute rule. ReplyReply Reply with quoteQuote Notify of repliesNotify 10380 Forums / Main Forum / A Call To All Christians on: April 02, 2005, 01:46:53 PM Quote Truth gets the spotlight and my heart soars at the sight of it. I am not seeking to feel a certain way, nor am I seeking intellectual prowess - but I am beginning to understand what is meant by seeking first His kingdom. I agree and the truth will set us free. Although i dont think that you should seek emotion the natural response to truth will affect us. Seeking Christ with all we have is essential. And i have found that the devil is in the details. So that is why i seperate the emotions from the intellect for the sake of discussion. I believe that we in the reformed movement have become intellectual calvinist which i have been fighting in myself. The temptation is to become a holiness movement and in the surrounding climate look just like our arminian brothers.Really what we accept as norm might not be real calvinism. We really must take a look at our religious culture and examine how that affects our thinking and compare it to the word of God in prayer. Modern day charismatics have a history of revival in this country in the Charles Finney theology. Our american calvinist fore fathers measured the state of the church by the revivals that is the great awakening kind that were breaking out and the level of religious affections that translated into conversions. 10396 Forums / Theology Forum / Man's Free Will Vs God's Sovereignity on: March 31, 2005, 10:48:39 PM We have free will to choose anything we want when we are unsaved. We do exactly what we want to do when we want. We are responsible for our actions from birth. But we are blind to spiritual things and cannot choose any thing good. Our motives are purely selfish in our choosing in our unredeemed state. When we do things for others we are wanting the glory for ourselves. We can do no good thing for God. All our good works are filthy rags. When we are regenerated we are given desires to glorify God in our bodys. The Holy Spirit takes residence in us and we are freed from sin. We still choose freely and now those choices are good by justification. We are given Christ righteousness and even though our works are tainted with sin they are accepted because of Christ. We choose freely to either obey the Spirit or not. 10401 Forums / Break Room / So, How Do Yew Meditate? on: March 30, 2005, 12:12:26 PM Sometimes we need to be put under great trials to bring us to the place where we are in deep meditation and prayer. The experience is painful and desperate because the Lord is teaching us not to rely on ourselves. THis is a faith builder and prayer becomes a source of the only comfort. Prayer is very intense and the crys of the heart are our only relief. We are left to trust only God because the help of man is useless. When we are desperate our sin crys out with accusations for us to lose heart, people around us are accusing because we are left with out the ability to defend ourselves. Circumstances are hopless and the outward pressure can be felt.We must tell God how we feel and that we want to defend His character most of all. THat is the desire of our hearts and when we are desperate we represent His name and He is most concerned for His glory. Fight in the Spirit of prayer. Dont lose your vision of who you are. Circumstancs dont define you but His confidence in you is that vision the devil is trying to put out. We are not perfect and that cannot be the means of victory. The gospel of Christ is the means applied to our hearts. The confidence in Him is that His righteousness is our righteousnss is the faith builder under great stress. ReplyReply Reply with quoteQuote Notify of repliesNotify 10402 Forums / Break Room / So, How Do Yew Meditate? on: March 30, 2005, 12:11:48 PM Sometimes we need to be put under great trials to bring us to the place where we are in deep meditation and prayer. The experience is painful and desperate because the Lord is teaching us not to rely on ourselves. THis is a faith builder and prayer becomes a source of the only comfort. Prayer is very intense and the crys of the heart are our only relief. We are left to trust only God because the help of man is useless. When we are desperate our sin crys out with accusations for us to lose heart, people around us are accusing because we are left with out the ability to defend ourselves. Circumstances are hopless and the outward pressure can be felt.We must tell God how we feel and that we want to defend His character most of all. THat is the desire of our hearts and when we are desperate we represent His name and He is most concerned for His glory. Fight in the Spirit of prayer. Dont lose your vision of who you are. Circumstancs dont define you but His confidence in you is that vision the devil is trying to put out. We are not perfect and that cannot be the means of victory. The gospel of Christ is the means applied to our hearts. The confidence in Him is that His righteousness is our righteousnss is the faith builder under great stress. 10417 Forums / Main Forum / It Is Finished on: March 27, 2005, 07:56:55 PM Before the creation of the world the Trinity counseled together to fulfill the ultimate purposes in the Godhead. They decreed that Christ would suffer for sin and fulfill all righteousness. The Father sent the Son and the Spirit. It was for the glory of God that all these things should be acomplished. The ultimate pleasure would be fulfilled in the Godhead because any other being could not fulfill those purposes.He suffered an eternal punishment to meet eternal demands as justice. He died as a man but hung on the cross being fully God. It was an act of love that is eternal and a particular love to those the Father gave the Son in the counsel before time. The work the Son did met the demands of the Father on the cross and open access to the throne of God. Those whom the Father chose before the foundation of the world are in the Son and stand righteous because of His righteousness. Now we have a sacrifice that is a once for all sacrifice and we come to the Father through Jesus Christ. We have boldness because His blood is more priceless than any earthly goods. It is a death and resurrection of great value. All the purposes in our lives are wraped in the ultimate purpose bringing Glory to God in Jesus Christ.We have eternal life that cannot fail because it is the purpose of Father to give the Son those for His glory and that is an eternal purpose in the Godhead. No other being could keep the eternal demands except Christ. Those who are not in Christ will suffer an eternal punishment. This is the requirement of God. Punishment that is any less would not be acceptable to the eternal demands. 10432 Forums / Theology Forum / Can Sin Be Recgonized And Confessed? on: March 27, 2005, 06:19:47 AM Joker Quote Let me put it this way: If you study sex to learn how to please your wife, that's admirable. If you prefer studying sex to making love to your wife, that's a problem. Nursie Quote ther are people who become so obsessed with theology that they become detached from the real world. They think they are transcended above the world and on some spiritual high but really they are just deluded and so detached that they are out of touch. Every one including you have motives that are selfish and prideful. If you study any subject that means that you are spending the time and that shows that you are intrested. Quantity time is important not quality, in the scriptures. Day and night are use over and over in the scriptures about thought life of spiritual things. We live in the transcendent where we communicate with God and He answers back. Our minds are in the heavenly realm. I cannot be not knowlegeable about God and love Him at the same time it is impossible. It really is the law of noncontridiction here. My motives are not always good but i know that the knowing about these things gives me freedom and independence. When you pray its like being in a spiritual battle and taking more territory in the spiritual realm. Granted i could use some more communication skills . Its not about being positive or negative.Jesus on witnessing in todays thinking was terrible because everyone left Him at the end because His message was too hard. If you dont have any enemys then you message may be too soft on the sin side. In a sense we are out of touch because there are more non christians than christians its just how much flack you want to take as a confronter. I leave the enemy thing in Gods hands because He does a better job than i could ever do. 10439 Forums / Break Room / So, How Do Yew Meditate? on: March 26, 2005, 04:35:40 AM Hours of meditation are relief from the tension of self indulgence and soul pain. A deep river of joy floods the soul with inconceivable flucuations of throne room loves and graces. Suspending all prevelent earthly connections in the God connection drives me into transcendent moods and extreme enlightened blessed eternal raptures. How can i explain the history of heavenly mindedness but by deeper longings and greater experiences of future glories until Christ is complete in me a worm. How can God share such love with a totally depraved person. What a mystery of this union with Christ but loves ends are Gods purposes for my soul. His love is a deep river of instant coolness to an inflamed temper. Oh God of all glory kill me with such wonderful raptures that engulf my feeble body until i meet you in glory. What other physical condition is worth the expendeture. 10442 Forums / Theology Forum / Election on: March 26, 2005, 03:35:28 AM Well at ch 8 im thinking ok so i have this righteousness and i have this struggle with remaning sin and i am not condemned any more so you begin to think that he is saying that you can share in this greak work of salvation, and also as a jew your thinking he really hasnt gotten to the bottom of my relying on circumscisian to save me. And then you come to ch 9 and here i will have to say is where my meditation was an experience of total pride killing. When i got out of ch 9 i was aw struck at the power of God and my total inability. Whatever pretenses i came out of ch 8 with were dashed by ch 9 it is truely a strike at mans pride to effect any change in his condition. I felt really helpless and my mind was affected with the blow at human intentions. It is here that we must come to grips with God holiness and the good fear of it. ReplyReply Reply with quoteQuote Notify of repliesNotify 10443 Forums / Theology Forum / Election on: March 26, 2005, 03:20:13 AM Hey guys, I ve medatated through Rom to ch. 11 many times and i think that Paul is really laying out the doctrine of grace from every possible angle. You get the greetings about the gospel and its sole ability to do the work, and answer all the sin problems of mankind because it solves the problem of mans unrighteousness by God righteousness. You have the great statment about mans condition and the steps in the rejection of the gospel. Paul is always trying to stay one up on how your are going to react by his present reasoning and so you say at this point i agree the world has rejected the gospel , then he pts the finger right at our self righteousness and say we are just like them. and he quotes the psams to prove that there is no one righteous not even one.then you come to ch 5 and there he starts on the doctrine of justification by faith as the sole reason for Gods righteousness being applied to our account. And then he goes on to sanctification and the doctrine of sin and his personal struggle with sin as a mature believer. His whole reasoning has been through an historical account of abraham because he is dealing with a jewish reader. ReplyReply Reply with quoteQuote Notify of repliesNotify 10444 Forums / Theology Forum / The New Phariseeism on: March 25, 2005, 05:16:17 AM I like to think as of freedom as living in the heavenly realms and feasting on the Lord at all times. To be honest this struggle of life brings me down because its all about what others do and what my responsibility is. It is a legal thinking that is oppressive. I love the gospel because it is simple but yet profound and powerful. It really is all about relationship with the Father. Some people think it is about the eggs they have in their basket and they have them all in order and they live a legal religious life. It seems that what happens is they end up with so many eggs they have no time to bask in the eternal life that they possess and the fellowship with the Father. I would rather have one egg and a life of heavenly joy and rest in the arms of my Heavenly Father. 10446 Forums / Theology Forum / Election on: March 25, 2005, 04:39:58 AM Hi everyone, I want to say a word about the feelings. They are important but they dont run your life. We are whole people and we should think properly as believers. What we think about really does have an impact on our feelings, have you ever drawn back and anolized you present thought patterns. Most everyone has thoughts racing through the mind. Little worries, lust, envy etc. I have spent a lot of time in quiet meditation on the word of God and prayer and i find that after this practice my thoughts are being directed rather than directing me. After a while of allowing your thoughts to go on by themselves then you form moods which form habits which lead to anguish.If you take your thoughts captive then you will be heavenly minded and you will be emotionally high. We have been given the Spirit and He doesnt over ride our habits but works with the desires and the word to convince us that we are just passing through this world. Our responsibility is vital if we are going to experience the presence of God. ReplyReply Reply with quoteQuote Notify of repliesNotify 10447 Forums / Theology Forum / You Can't Go Against The Leadership on: March 25, 2005, 04:09:09 AM Hi everyone, If the guy dosent stand up for himself no one else will. If he is saved and has a complaint that is legitimate then he should tell the pastor with out being ostrasized.I have seen personality conflicts before but the leaders should know how to deal with that. Most pastors get into the ministry for the wrong reasons. They want to tell everyone what to do and there is no accountibility. I ask this one thing because i think it is the bulls eye of the problem in the church today. Are the people for the church or is the church for the people? The latter is the biblical one. It really is all about service. Every one is equal in Gods eyes as far as submitting to the whole counsel of God. There are not two sets of rules one for the leadership and one for the congregation. Sheparding is the word that comes to mind here. Christ is the head of the church some pastors think that they are. 10449 Forums / Theology Forum / Election on: March 23, 2005, 09:47:40 PM In the providence of God there is common grace and special grace. In the world there is common grace that is God has gifted men with talents, family, arts, and phlanthropy so that His glory is seen. We enjoy these graces and these graces also extend to the whosoever will may come. Then there is special grace, which comes at salvation. This is by the soveriegn act of God, and comes by grace alone with out any of mans works.There is the bare will of God in special grace. All other doctrines are a philosophy. Philosophy and doctrine cannot intermingle. Some people in the world have better common grace than the christians special grace. 10472 Forums / Theology Forum / Can Sin Be Recgonized And Confessed? on: March 20, 2005, 10:50:34 PM Nursie im sorry for my inflamatory remarks. i assumed that you were saying that i was not saved. If thats all your upset about then lets be patient with one another. I certianly think that you have been very nice to me and i dont want you to construe that i dont like you. Thanks for the advice. I recognize now that you are trying to help i will pray about this and try to be a little more communative. A lot of the reason that i dont reply in personal response is i just dont have the time. Please give me the benefit of the doubt. Thanks 10475 Forums / Theology Forum / Can Sin Be Recgonized And Confessed? on: March 20, 2005, 10:04:42 PM Nursie if you are going to attack my faith then you are not gracious but hateful. You are judging my eternity based apoun my knowlege and pride. Not all pride is bad if its a pride in God. No doubt that i struggle with many sins and i am have also said that i am addicted to sin which you left out. You should not tell people they are not saved by a forum discussion. You need to give people the courtisy of being able to say their feelings and knowlege and not search their motives. You are being mean. Please i have not said one thing about your relationship with God and i think you are a nice person but i think you are going to far here and you will alienate a lot of people. I am sorry that i was so foward but i really feel that you are being mean. Remove messageRemove ReplyReply Reply with quoteQuote Notify of repliesNotify 10476 Forums / Theology Forum / Can Sin Be Recgonized And Confessed? on: March 20, 2005, 09:53:32 PM You have compartmentalized your life and have neglected the development of your soul. (when I say soul I am referring to the personality, not the spirit.) What is a tricodomist but a person that brings God down to a sub god. You are saying that the mind cannot understand spiritual things until the soul is searched into. Because you put the mind with the soul.The mind is part of the spirit of a person and God is the only one that can transform the mind.Man is body and spirit or soul. A spiritual transaction must take place not a counseling session. Remove messageRemove ReplyReply Reply with quoteQuote Notify of repliesNotify 10477 Forums / Theology Forum / Can Sin Be Recgonized And Confessed? on: March 20, 2005, 09:32:28 PM Could a person be so enamoured and impressed with themselves over their own knowledge of theology that theology becomes their god rather than God Himself? You are saying that i am not a christian here because you question my motives for knowing God. I am very proud of knowing the truths and i am not surrounded by people who disparage my dedication. I would say to you if you want to judge people then you will be judged in the same way. When you judge my motives you are going against the scripture calling the brother recca. If you see an area of pride in me you should cover over it. You disparage former pastors based on the attitudes they have and call them a cult because they were controlling. You did not give one objective argument about a specific sin that would disqulify them from the ministry. Instead you complained about them using control. How can you accuse people of something that is so subjective and call them a cult. Remove messageRemove ReplyReply Reply with quoteQuote Notify of repliesNotify 10478 Forums / Theology Forum / Can Sin Be Recgonized And Confessed? on: March 20, 2005, 09:15:35 PM What have i stated here that brings you to question my motives? I did not say that i rejected all psychology but only the stuff that says that a person can seek God through Christ and not find Him. When a person seeks God imperfectly or from wrong motives should he stop ? Can a person seek God with a sinful heart and have assurance that He has found Him. Did you say that i am not a believer? Thats what it sound like to me. When you question my motives you are talking about a false conversion. When you write your post you are saying something about the God you know. Does your God bless the person who doesnt spend the time knowing all the details about who He is? Does He withhold His love to those who cry out to Him throughout the day? Do you bring God down to your relationship level and say that all transcendent motions in the person are manic? Have you considered that a promise to those who meditate on Gods word are blessed? Do you know the spiritual guides in my life and have you talked to them. Does your God answer the desperate people or does He wait until they have talked to a psycologist? Does your God not promise that if you speak highly about His love before the saints that He will answer your prayers? Do you have a prayer life where you have direct answers to your prayers and you have listed them in your mind? I dont think that wbennet was questioning my motives ,were you wbennet? I am defending myself because i feel that you judged my motives for eternal life and i only answer to God. 10503 Forums / Theology Forum / Can Sin Be Recgonized And Confessed? on: March 20, 2005, 07:19:42 AM Sin is a principle in us and is connected to idols that we carry around in our minds. The view of ourselves is always tainted with a love of self. We acknowlege sin when we commit it. But just acknowlegeing it is not getting to the heart or root of sin. The Psalmist say that the sins in him is greater than he can number. He says that his sin is over his head. At times he is unhappy because the disipline he is going through is a result of practicing sin and having love for it. There is a sense that the more we look inside the more we see our sin. When we confess sin and turn from it we leave it for a short time and return to the same sin again. Everyone has a favorite sin that is so ingrained in them that sometimes they dont know that they really believe. There is a sin of the heart that is just natural to them and it is a security to them and makes them feel good about themselves to view themselves in a better light. Ive seen the best of men tainted by their sin , little idol makers. When we think that we have arrived and become self sufficient thinking that we can cruise through life with no mourning over the state of our hearts we are arrogant and are in need of mercy. The standard for the believer is perfection and to love the Lord with all heart , mind , soul. Man, and i am not trying to be condescending but i think it is really short to think that you can confess a few sins in His presence and feel you have done complete forgiveness, Martin Luther practiced confession for hours over sin. He drove the preist mad over confession. He would confess until he felt that he could go on his way and then after a few steps he would remember 20 more sins.This is leaglism! There are hidden sins that we cannot see for our own sanity i think. I mean the difference between me and the maniac is that God doesnt allow me to see all the filth in my heart if He did i would be a dead. Its grace that im His and all of grace. Christ died to cover all my sin and that was once for all. He is working in me a process where my conscience is not condemned because He is greater than my conscience. Through suffering He is bringing the dross to the surface and purifying me. 10508 Forums / Theology Forum / Election on: March 19, 2005, 05:10:41 AM Election is an exalted doctrine to show forth the glory of God and to aim at the evil of pride that exist in all of us. In ephesians ch.1 Paul is bringing to us the reason for his singular focus that brought about his courage to stand and proclaim the gospel in the midst of extreme suffering within and threats of death without. He gets so carried away with affection that he starts sentence and piles one idea apoun another with out stopping to start a new sentence. Is as if he were standing in the pulpit high above the congregation with fire in his eyes lost in the glory and wonders of the Most High. He is an example of what happens to us when we experience the effects of the preaching of election. Election exalts God and has direct effects apoun the minds of His created dependents.A person under the power of the gospel of Gods soveriegnty is effected in such a way that he is convinced that he has no power to go on in existence of time without Gods rule. That drives the divided heart of mixed desires to relinquish the hold on idols by a distress of facing the truth of the gospel and and under such helplessness by the distress comes a rejoicing in God that He alone effects the change in the inward parts. That my friend is the experience of election preaching and that is the spiritual renewel that is needed in todays message. In a heightened awarness it brings about revival. ReplyReply Reply with quoteQuote Notify of repliesNotify 10509 Forums / Theology Forum / Does Evil Come From God? on: March 19, 2005, 04:24:08 AM James says that God is not the author of sin. The angels were created to worship God and do His will. They had a free will because not only did Lucifer rebel but He took with him a large number of angelic beings. There is mystery here and we know that God decreed that evil should exist in a permssive way. Nothing exist without Gods decrees yet evil did not come from Him. In Romans it says that the existence of evil makes Gods glory appear greater. The muchness of the attributes of God come from the backdrop of evil. Now we have an apoligetical inlargement for Gods love by the antithetical existence of hate. The antithetical argument is also apparent in the apprehending of the grace of God as greater than sin. It is apparent in God being the highest above other gods. We are created with the desire to excel even more in our spiritual understanding. We are overcomers by the power of the Spirit in the struggle with the flesh. We are created as transcendent beings to a supernatural experience over against the course of the world and power of satan. 10533 Forums / Theology Forum / The Seven Dispensations on: March 16, 2005, 05:31:46 AM Creation to fall Innocency Fall to flood Conscience Flood to Abraham Human Government Abraham to Moses Promise Moses to Christ Law Church Age Grace Millennium Kingdom The dispensation in scripture is a management that man has been given. But I think the dividing of the scriptures into dispensations is hard to find in scripture. God is soveriegn and He makes covenants that have a promise that will go according to His plan.A covenant in scripture is not like men make covenants with themselves. God promises and gives the grace to carry it out. He provides the forgiveness when it is broken by man. I rather see covenants that God made with man as found in the scripture. The covenant to preserve mankind after the flood. The covenant with Abraham a salvific covenant.The new covenant a further light on salvation. I dont agree with dispensationalist that God gives man a management and when His plan fails He turns to a different age or management. I think the above charastics can be found from the begining of time in salvation all 7 of them. I dont characterize the garden as innocence. Our conscience is used by the law to condemn us and when we are saved it is by grace alone, we have access to all the promises, Christ is our king or ruler who we answer to in all of life, while we are here on earth there will always be human governments.Finally Gods plans never fails and man is never the center of His workings. God never changes so the bible is a progressive revelation of who God is and what he requires. Salvation by faith alone is as old as Adam, but was not revealed as it is now. Its like going into a dark room and you only see a few things but as time goes on the light gets brighter. That is the hermenutics of scripture.