7585	Forums / Main Forum / Conscience & Feelings Or The Word Of The Lord?	on: April 08, 2007, 08:09:09 PM
There was no one who rivaled the sensitivity of Martin Luthers conscience. In fact His insistence on confessing every sin that is taking whole days to confess individual sins would drive those who were around him to the limits of their patience. The thing that Luther learned was that He would try to get to the point where he had confessed every sin that he was aware of, but when he had listed the last one and confessed it , he was stricken once more by his conscience that there were other ones that he needed to confess. Luther realized after studing romans that he was doing his whole religious practice in self righteousness. It wasnt until he had come to the Just shall live by faith that he was finally released from the legal relationship to the law and saw that grace covered all of his sins. Our consciences have a place in teaching us that we are sinning but the conscience has no saving power. The conscience is the condemning agent that takes the law and dives it into our hearts through condemnation. Satan can use a sensitive conscience to hold people in the jail of the condemning power of the law so that they hardly ever get familiar with gospel conviction. Our consciences must be trained by the word of God to descern good and evil. We must obey the Spirit and the word and not make the conscience the moral compass through action. Any one who thinks that they can have a completely clear conscience has only decieved themselves as to the depth of their sin , making a law unto themselves. Our consciences can be cleaned by the word of God only and not by our trying to make up for past wrongs. When we trust in our own ability to clean our consciences by a moral standard we set up, then we are only deceiving ourselves and we will never get to the root of sin. Because sin must be killed by grace, obeying God is mortifying the flesh by the Spirit, who uses the word to clean our consciences. It is done when we examine ourselves and we see our sin, and we turn our sin over to Christ. Even if we are not aware of all of our sins His work on the cross has taken care of sin for all eternity. We are always going to have our consciences active. The problem is we are always more trusting of ourselves to relieve our consciences rather than really having the forgiveness of Christ get to the bottom our cleaning our whole soul. David wanted all of His parts cleaned by the work of the Spirit. He wanted the Spirit to enliven His confession so that He would have assurance of Gods forgiveness. It is only when we can take our sin before God and experience His unfailing love, His faithfulness, His condescending kindness toward us as sinners in our worse sins, that we are able to get a grip on the work of guilt and the conscience. We are completely open before God. He knows when we are going to sin before we commit the act. He knows us deeper than our feelings of guilt. His eye is on our deepest desires which go much deeper than feelings of guilt. He is working in us and it is at the root of sin in its inception in the desiring part that God does the work rather than our corrupted knowledge of ourselves. The Spirit of God does not deal with us in a self determined paradigm. Our desires cause us to choose. We never choose by moral accusations. Our Father is not an accuser of the saints. He is not a prosecuting attorney.Christ is our advocate, who has taken care of our sin once for all. Our consciences are the prosecuting attorney, and only has a small place in grace. Our consciences make us go to Christ by helping us cling to grace away from the sting of the law. 7594  Forums / Theology Forum / The Donkey Messenger on: April 07, 2007, 05:08:47 PM Quote Quote I dont agree with you. There is only one reason that a Jew would want to be delivered from the bondage of sorrounding nations in the context of the Theocracy and that was the temple worship and the renewal of the sacrifices. Although the nation was involved in deliverance , yet the focus was on purelyGod being worshiped in the temple. Just as the reason for going into captivity was the lifting up of the Aseroth poles ie the idols as a national sin and not a covenant people sin. So that the remnant was in view whenever God rescued the nation. And although there were the called but not chosen group within the chosen yet the purpose of all national deliverences was for the worshiping of the true God. Shabbat shalom, mbG! Well of course you don't agree with me! That's why you miss the point! Don't you know yet that "salvation is of the Jews?!" John 4:21-24 21 Jesus saith unto her, Woman, believe me, the hour cometh, when ye shall neither in this mountain, nor yet at Jerusalem, worship the Father. 22 Ye worship ye know not what: we know what we worship: for salvation is of the Jews. 23 But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him. 24 God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth. KJV You, as are all Gentiles, believers or not, are in the same condition as the Samaritan woman at the well! Since the rescue is of the Jews--the Y'hudim--Judaea--the "Southern Kingdom of Judah," if it must be put to you that way, consisting of the tribes of Y'hudah (Judah), Binyamin (Benjamin), and much of the Levi'im (Levites), we are talking about the promises made to those who gave allegiance to the royal line of David and Shlomo (Solomon), not the sham kingdom of Shomron (Samaria) under their first king, Yarav`am (Jeroboam). You are GREATLY mistaken, if you think it's all about the "temple and animal sacrifice!" It's about the MESSIAH, YHVH'S Representative to be King, the Rescuer! It's about having Elohim's glory back "in the camp!" Although the reformed Jews today question whether there will really be an individual known as the Messiah, the Orthodox Jews, especially those living in Yisra'el and in Yerushalayim, are constantly praying for the return of G-D'S glory! The rebuilding of the temple would just be a step toward that goal. They pray at the Western Wall for G-D's intervention to that end! Reformed Thelogians and everyone who believes in Replacement Theology, hear only half of what Rav Sha'ul (the Apostle Paul) said in Romans chapters 9 through 11! Look at Romans 11 in its entirety: 11:1 "In that case, I say, isn't it that God has repudiated his people?" Heaven forbid! For I myself as a son of Isra'el, from the seed of Avraham, (2 Chron. 20:7; Psalm 105:6) of the tribe of Binyamin. 2 God has not repudiated his people, (1 Sam. 12:22; Psalm 94:14) whom he chose in advance. Or don't you know what the Tanakh says about Eliyahu? He pleads with God against Isra'el, 3 "ADONAI, they have killed your prophets and torn down your altars, and I'm the only one left, and now they want to kill me too!" (1 Kings 19:10, 14) 4 But what is God's answer to him? "I have kept for myself seven thousand men who have not knelt down to Ba`al." (1 Kings 19:18) 5 It's the same way in the present age: there is a remnant, chosen by grace. 6 (Now if it is by grace, it is accordingly not based on legalistic works; if it were otherwise, grace would no longer be grace.) 7 What follows is that Isra'el has not attained the gola for which she is striving. The ones chosen have obtained it, but the rest have been made stonelike, 8 just as the Tanakh says, "God has given them a spirit of dullness-- eyes that do not see and ears that do not hear, right down to the present day." (Deut. 29:4, Isa. 29:10) 9 And David says, "Let their dining table become for them a snare and a trap, a pitfall and a punishment. 10 Let their eyes be darkened, so that they can't see, with their backs bent continually." (Psalm 69:22-23) 11 "In that case, I say, isn't it that they have stumbled with the result that they have permanently fallen away?" Heaven forbid! Quite the contrary, it is by means of their stumbling that the deliverance has come to the Gentiles, in order to provoke them to jealousy. (Deut. 32:21) 12 Moreover, if their stumbling is bringing riches to the world--that is, if Isra'el's being placed temporarily in a condition less favored than that of the Gentiles is bringing riches to the latter--how much greater riches will Isra'el in its fullness bring them! 13 However, to those of you who are Gentiles I say this: since I myself am an emissary sent to the Gentiles, I make known the importance of my work 14 in the hope that somehow I may provoke some of my own people to jealousy and save some of them! 15 For it their casting Yeshua aside means reconciliation for the world, what will their accepting him mean? It will be life from the dead! 16 Now if the hallah offered as firstfruits is holy, so is the whole loaf. And if the root is holy, so are the branches. 17 But if some of the branches were broken off, and you--a wild olive--were grafted in among them and have become equal sharers in the rich root of the olive tree, 18 then don't boast as if you were better than the branches! However, if you do boast, remember that you are not supporting the root, the root is supporting you. 19 So you will say, "Branches were broken off so that I might be grafted in." 20 True, but so what? They were broken off because of their lack of trust. However, you keep your place only because of your trust. So don't be arrogant; on the contrary, be terrified! 21 For if God did not spare the natural branches, he certainly won't spare you! 22 So take a good look at God's kindness and his severity: on the one hand, severity toward those who fell off; but, on the other hand, God's kindness toward you--provided you maintain yourself in that kindness! Otherwise, you too will be cut off! 23 Moreover, the others, if they do not persist in their lack of trust, will be grafted in; because God is able to graft them back in. 24 For if you were cut out of what is by nature a wild olive tree and grafted, contrary to nature, into a cultivated olive tree, how much more will these natural branches be grafted back into their own olive tree! 25 For, brothers, I want you to understand this truth which God formerly concealed but has now revealed, so that you won't imagine you know more than you actually do. It is that stoniness, to a degree, has come upon Isra'el, until the Gentile world enters in its fullness; 26 and that it is in this way that all Isra'el will be saved. As the Tanakh says, "Out of Tziyon will come the Redeemer; he will turn away ungodliness from Ya`akov 27 and this will be my covenant with them, ... when I take away their sins." (Isa. 59:20-21, 27:9) 28 With respect to the Good News they are hated for your sake. But with respect to being chosen they are loved for the Patriarchs' sake, 29 for God's free gifts and his calling are irrevocable. 30 Just as you yourselves were disobedient to God before but have received mercy now because of Isra'el's disobedience; 31 so also Isra'el has been disobedient now, so that by your showing them the same mercy that God has shown you, they too may now receive God's mercy. 32 For God has shut up all mankind together in disobedience, in order that he might show mercy to all. 33 O the depth of the riches and the wisdom and knowledge of God! How inscrutable are his judgments! How unsearchable are his ways! 34 For, 'Who has known the mind of the Lord? Who has been his counselor?' (Isa. 40:13) 35 Or, 'Who has given him anything and made him pay it back?' (Job 41:3) 36 For from him and through him and to him are all things. To him be the glory forever! Amen. (pronounced "ah-MAIN" is Hebrew for "Truth!") CJB Please be careful with God's people; He hasn't thrown them away for keeps! (By the way, they are COMING BACK TO HIM IN DROVES!) Retrobyter  Yes well i do hope that youall are seeing the imprint of Christ existence in your own back yard because it is shouting above the height of your roof tops. And really justification by faith in the coming messiah was as ot as it was nt. It was never in the animal, but it was in the covenant of grace.The animal sacrifices were a temporary apeasment of the wrath of God until the final atonement who was the lamb of God , purposed in eternity in the Trinity, one in essence three in Persons . And if you are trusting in your own righteousness , then your faith is on shaky ground. And your sacrifices are ever before the Lord, but His answer to you I do not rebuke you for your sacrifices or your burnt offerings which are ever before me, I have no need bull from your stalls or the goats from your pens for every animal of the forest is mine and the cattle on a thousand hills, I know every bird in the mountians and the beast of the feild is mine sacrifice your thank offerings to God , fulfill your vows to the most High, call apoun me in the day of trouble and i will deliver you. Yes if there is any thing from the creation of the world that could alter the purposes in God in saving then it would be of our own possession. Wow, Look God is actually soveriegn even over those uncaged animals. And since the temple curtian was rent from top to bottom , because the articles in the Holy of holies had long since lost their power seein that Christ was the fulfillment of the ot cirumonial sacrifical system and only because Israel was in the past looking forward to the Messiah and now we who are in Christ are looking back at the fulfillment of the law. Now we know that it is not through our faith that we can approach the throne of heaven, but it is through divine favor offered to His elect, who are ever thanking Him through their own inability , and only in His purposed salvation do we stand. Yes we are made alive and if we mix our own works or our own faith in the absolute soverieng plan of God we will only give what we lack. And so that iland of rightousness of the self effort of the animal or the theology of the garden leaves dress will keep us from gloring in the free grace of God. Praise Him that He did it all.   Remove Reply Quote Notify 7595  Forums / Main Forum / How To Deal With The Mentally Ill on: April 07, 2007, 12:59:54 PM Luke 14 13.     \"But when you give a reception, invite the poor, the crippled, the lame, the blind, 21.     \"And the slave came back and reported this to his master. Then the head of the household became angry and said to his slave, `Go out at once into the streets and lanes of the city and bring in here the poor and crippled and blind and lame.' Wow , these people are the ones who are called to worship. Not the rich or the healthy. Maybe the call is little prejudice?